cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/12876226
The measure that sailed unanimously through the House Energy and Commerce Committee would prohibit TikTok from US app stores unless the social media platform — used by roughly 170 million Americans — is quickly spun off from its China-linked parent company, ByteDance.
US officials have cited the widespread commercial availability of US citizens’ data as another source of national security risk. The US government and other domestic law enforcement agencies are also known to have purchased US citizens’ data from commercial data brokers.
This may sound like a rhetorical question but I promise it’s sincere.
Why would I be more concerned about China having my data than when the US has the potential to collect that same data AND MUCH MORE through surveillance that we know they do? My own government has a much higher potential to do me harm than one on the other side of the world.
Saw another post that had many great points. What if TikTok leaned into propaganda, topics like reunification with Taiwan? I promise that will effect us, big time.
Good point, let’s censor political speech.
What if China bought targeted ads on Meta?
That’s never affected our country at all…
I agree that would be problematic.
However I’m not willing to allow the government to ban a social media platform that a lot of people enjoy and rely on for community building (or even their livelihoods, in a lot of creators’ cases) on a “what if”.
Think about the precedent this sets. What could it be used on next?
In case I’m being downvoted because you think I’m worried about a slippery slope for no reason, I’ll link the full text of the bill here.
The process is basically that the president determines that an app is an issue, notifies Congress (who does not need to give approval), then within a certain time period the foreign owner of the all must divest ownership or it would become illegal to distribute that app.
There are definitions laid out in the text. I see nothing that would stop them from banning foreign news sources or potentially foreign shopping platforms except for the clause about “permits a user to create an account or profile to generate, share, and view text, images, videos, real-time communications, or similar content”, which could be broadly interpreted.
Do you really want to give the executive branch basically unchecked power to limit our access to voices from outside the country?
https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/7521/text?format=txt&r=1&s=1
I think you’re farther down that slippery slope than you think you are. We have more access to foreign voices from outside the country than we’ve ever had in history. A lot of that is through social media owned by US companies who are not the target of this legislation.
Twitter has been pretty instrumental in swaying public favor to the Palestinians in Gaza despite Israel (a US ally) trying to paint a different narrative. Now imagine if Twitter was owned by an Israeli company. Would we see all those horrific pictures and videos in Gaza? Would we even know if we weren’t seeing them? Would we have any legal or legislative options if we did uncover feed manipulation?
I think maybe the reason you aren’t fully on board with this is that you seem to have a strong distrust of the US government. More than our foreign adversaries. That’s fair and you are entitled to that. The people on the other side of the issue trust the US government more than foreign adversaries and that changes the calculation.
Can it be used on conservatives and fascists? Can we use it to destroy right wing media outlets and overthrow the 1996 Telecommunications Act? Can we use it to band together and hunt down evangelicals who commit child abuse through radical indoctrination? Can we use it to hunt down corporate lobbyists and the Congressmen who take their bribes?
Not unless those things are owned by foreign companies, which I doubt those are
What if isn’t a valid reason for jack shit.
It already happened in other countries. Philippines and Indonesia elected their old dictators after a successful campaign on TikTok to whitewash their crimes so that Gen Z vote for them.
China absolutely doesn’t want the US talking about Taiwan or the island of Taipei at all. They want the West to forget it exists entirely so they can “reunify” with it the same way they squashed out Democracy Riots in Hong Kong once the west got bored and stopped paying attention.
Because China has interests that are in opposition to US interests, and they can sway US opinion any way they want by covertly manipulating the feed. They absolutely can do significant harm with this, including but not limited to selecting politicians, inciting chaos and political unrest, and even economic destabilization. I’m not sure that the US government actually has a much higher potential to do you harm than a foreign enemy of the US with a weapon like social media as you stated. You could make a strong argument that the political shitshow we are currently in is partially due to foreign interference through social media, and that is before they owned the actual platforms. The US government is not incentivized to destabilize itself at least.
As an individual I’d rather be giving my data to China who probably have no interest in me personally, rather than a Five Eyes country who want my data to spy on me, and have more interest in persecuting me, stopping me at borders, etc.
probably because China is a foreign country and the US is (presumably) where you reside, and you should apparently trust your own government only. but i don’t know exactly what a foreign government would want with your personal data anyways
I can insult Trump and Biden on social networks, travel to the US then travel back alive to my home country.
I wouldn’t try that with China.
Each country has the right to say if businesses or entities of a foreign country can operate in their borders. The US Govt is rarely directly involved with operationing a company or business, with the biggest exception being the US Postal Service. So while they might make rules and regulations for how companies can do business, these businesses are privately owned, what information they gather on clients or users is for commercial use, typically for advertising purposes.
With Chinese companies, this is not the case, even companies that are technically privately owned are heavily managed by the CCP if not directly operated or owned by an official member of the govt. So while in the US if a company like Instagram or Twitter was told by the US govt to hand over information about certain individuals, without a warrent clearly defining what data to hand over and the reason for it, those companies can and in the past repeatedly have used legal means to resist and deny those demands. This isn’t a thing n China, and there is a lot of rumors that all the data these Chinese originating platforms collect by default goes to the Chinese govt, who can use it for anything from espionage, using insider information gathered illegally to manipulate markets or officials, to even things like blackmail or planning military actions in extreme cases. The CCP and all their associated companies have repeatedly shown in the past they don’t care about the rights of citizens in other countries, copyright laws or intellectual rights, and would be more than happy to turn every teenagers smart phone into a listening device into peoples homes and tailor content shown to individuals they identified as someone they can manipulate to radicalize them in a manner that suits them without any regard to that persons wellbeing.
If you think the US Government is untrustworthy (which, yeah it’s not) then you should be absolutely horrified at the thought of ever allowing the Chinese Govt and the CCP having access to any of your personal life or allowed to put software on your device and partake in a social network they curate and moderate.