Phlubba might be referring to right wing youths who would hypothetically vote against Biden or not vote at all, cascading into a loss of US Democracy and eventually the fall of NATO and potentially democracy across the world as a whole. I don’t think our situation is necessarily that bad, but it’s definitely one of many possible futures.
Ah, that would be a metaphor. “Blaze it with their free unicorn pony” is supposed to represent any unrealistic and fundamentally flawed policy goal that the aforementioned hypothetical children would be willing to risk the end of democracy if they do not obtain. Again, I don’t necessarily agree with their statement, but it at least is coherent enough.
Well since you’re speaking for someone else, how about we just ask them who was closer to “what they meant” instead of just presuming with your blatant strawman?
When the fate of your entire legal system hinges on the cast of Pineapple Express showing up to vote for the correct candidate, democracy may have already ended and you just didn’t notice.
Yes this is literally par for the course for every single presidential campaign in history.
They promise what they’ll do. They don’t say try to do because that’s been tested in marketing and certainty sounds better. Nevertheless it’s not Biden’s fault his agenda for what he’s been voted into office on is being blocked by the opposition for poor reasons.
The question isn’t why isn’t Biden doing this, the issue is why are Republicans blocking it and why aren’t you trying to convince them and their supporters?
If I can’t believe any of the good campaign promises from biden because everyone lies, why should we take the scary campaign promises of republicans seriously?
Let’s review this as I’m seeing goalpost moving and circular reasoning present, forgetting curiously strange double-standards in where one directs their attention:
I highlight the fact that all Marijuana legalization, decriminalization initiatives, referendums have come under the Democratic party with Democratic states being the trailblazers
You ignore this fact.
You Pivot to why Biden is making promises he can’t keep
I point to the fact that this is universal and the promise would be kept if it wasn’t for Republican Obstruction
I ask why you concern yourself so much with Biden and not the obvious Republican obstructionists and their base whom you would be better served convincing in their comment threads.
Again, you ignore this inquiry.
You pivot to downplaying Trump’s bad promises because they MIGHT be obstructed (rightfully so) by Democrats. (Forget the fact that one GOP/Trump Promise of overturning Roe came to fruition)
I thus this proves my point.
You, again, ignore this, then circle back to why Biden isn’t trying harder. This is ostensibly victim-blaming. In other words, “Why isn’t the hero of the story not doing MORE to overcome the villain!?”
It’s more like he’s bandwagoning something that now has popular support, without actually accomplishing much.
Yes, it’s pretty normal that popular things are often adopted by Presidential candidates. Kind of a no-brainer, don’t you think? As I said before: (1) It’s popular, and (2) Biden needs those youth voters. If it’s so popular, why isn’t Trump doing it? Why are Republicans so opposed? This finally begs the question: Why WOULDN’T Biden support it if he could? The answer is: there is no valid reason, which means Republicans are largely to blame while the workarounds are cumbersome and even run the risk of wasting time in front of the conservative Supreme Court, jeopordizing future attempts at decriminalization.
Politicians change minds. Legalization has become far more popular in recent times. At the end of the day, like it or not, Democrats and Biden are still the best pathways toward decriminalization. We certainly won’t get anything out of Trump and Republicans (which it strikes me as odd you tried to downplay Trump above).
At this point if it looks quacks and acts like a duck it probably is one. To bystanders reading this thread, this user demonstrates all classic signs of a right-wing operative intending to gaslight, sow defeatism, and wedge-drive Democrats.
I highlight the fact that all Marijuana legalization, decriminalization initiatives, referendums have come under the Democratic party with Democratic states being the trailblazers
You ignore this fact.
Because its not true. There’s a Republican led bill introduced as recently as 2023.
Yet even so, you point to the edge-case exceptions while I point to the norm. For example, preceding the States Reform Act, Democrats beat them to the punch with the MORE Act, so your point is of such low-hanging fruit and the biggest exception – NOT TO MENTION – it literally won’t be brought to the floor for a vote thanks to none other than ® Mike Johnson…
Today, I am announcing three steps that I am taking to end this failed approach.
First, I am announcing a pardon of all prior Federal offenses of simple possession of marijuana. I have directed the Attorney General to develop an administrative process for the issuance of certificates of pardon to eligible individuals. There are thousands of people who have prior Federal convictions for marijuana possession, who may be denied employment, housing, or educational opportunities as a result. My action will help relieve the collateral consequences arising from these convictions.
Second, I am urging all Governors to do the same with regard to state offenses. Just as no one should be in a Federal prison solely due to the possession of marijuana, no one should be in a local jail or state prison for that reason, either.
Third, I am asking the Secretary of Health and Human Services and the Attorney General to initiate the administrative process to review expeditiously how marijuana is scheduled under federal law. Federal law currently classifies marijuana in Schedule I of the Controlled Substances Act, the classification meant for the most dangerous substances. This is the same schedule as for heroin and LSD, and even higher than the classification of fentanyl and methamphetamine – the drugs that are driving our overdose epidemic.
In effect, Biden has de-facto decriminalized Marijuana. Let me know if he prosecutes marijuana possession in legal states.
except you never addressed anything they said. youre acting just like trump cultists, where all evidence is fake anf theres always an excuse. its a bad look.
why should we take the scary campaign promises of republicans seriously?
Because the scary promises have support from those currently in power and are therefore much more likely to be implemented. Nice promises of change with support from the people are far less likely because the they face not only resistance from the opposing party, but the people are easily propagandized (by those currently in power) to not vote or vote against their interests.
I dunno being visibly queer under trump didn’t feel worse than under biden.
Where are you? I could mostly say the same thing living in a blue area, but I’m not willing to throw my LGBTQIA fam under the bus because I’m pissy about Democrats. Fascism is a silly threat being dangled by Biden, it’s a risk you and I take of being thrown in the oven.
I’m really struggling to understand how you don’t understand how this works. I have to conclude you’re doing this in bad faith, given you implied your age is pretty high.
That they aren’t promises but goals. The Biden administration (and about every administration) works towards everything they say they’ll do, how much they get done is determined by their majority and the willingness of the opposition to work with them.
You’ve already been told this in an earlier reply by someone else.
They promise what they’ll do. They don’t say try to do because that’s been tested in marketing and certainty sounds better.
President’s aren’t dictators, but they do have an amount of control of pushing for specific legislation, and the big “promises” are about trying to push this legislation.
Other promises can get stalled even if it’s within the president’s authority, like Biden’s student debt relief was stalled by the Supreme Court.
Well, I don’t have a study backing me up, but in my experience, promising what you can’t deliver often results in being called a liar.
I really don’t know why “other candidates do it” would be an excuse. The whole pitch for voting for him is that he is supposed to be better than the other candidates. Seems like whataboutism.
It’s not really about how politics work. It is about how human minds work. The fact that making empty promises and then excuses is more effective than being honest shows one of the reasons why democracy isn’t a good system (although it may currently be the least bad).
And just accepting the lies probably makes it worse.
You might as well just not vote at all because not a single president will ever keep every campaign promise they make. Ever. You don’t have to like it but that’s reality and the only reason to be mad about it for one specific candidate over another is personal bias.
Obviously everyone should vote but unless you’re new to all of this you should already know to pick your battles. If campaign promises weren’t kept you should research it and know why before you complain about it.
I get what you’re saying on principle, but the reality is that the world does not work like that. There’s a reason populism is often a quick way to get to power, because you just promise whatever people want to hear so you could be elected. People don’t vote based on logic, people vote based on emotion, which means people don’t consider what is realistic, they consider what speaks to them.
Is his campaign promising things he doesn’t have the power to do?
A president can do almost NOTHING unilaterally. What they’re promising you is what they’ll support if it makes it to their desk. This is how checks and balances work… if you want to vote for someone who has sworn to be as shitty as possible because the guy who swore to do things you want can’t just snap his fingers and make it happen, I guess nobody can stop you…
What you’re finding is that the Democratic party is still interested in a functioning government where people don’t just vote the party line like a borg - which results in more difficulty passing legislation. Unfortunately, “both sides same” isn’t remotely accurate which you’re finding out.
Idk? What point is being made? That Democrats took a modest aesthetic step toward fixing a problem they helped create? A problem that runs much deeper than the scheduling of drugs and a problem that destroyed entire communities of color?
I’m not interested in engaging in a debate with you, I just think it’s important to recognize the depth of the issues being discussed and be skeptical of the accomplishments being touted during an election year.
We’re in a thread about a concern-troll criticizing Biden for not doing MORE on Marijuana decriminalization.
I point to the fact that literally all Marijuana legalization efforts have stemmed from Democrats.
And since we know Republicans will do nothing on this and in fact take us backwards in most cases, there really isn’t a further point to be made.
Thus, within the given context, calling Democrats’ action on Marijuan legalization, decriminalization, and outright pardoning of offenders a “modest aesthetic” is gross euphemism.
It is, of course, conveniently never enough with folks; and to that I point to the famed adage, “never left perfection get in the way of progress.”
Asking how old someone is completely defeats the purpose. We’ve seen how boomers mishandled things and pulled the ladders up behind them so let’s not pretend that being old and remembering 1994 “like it was pretty recent” (it wasn’t) makes your opinion in any way superior.
It’s relevant and recent when the majority of the legislators who passed the law are still in congress
We’ve seen how boomers mishandled things and pulled the ladders up behind them
That’s exactly my point. We’re still living in the reality of laws passed by boomers - hell, we’re still being governed by them. That reality doesn’t just go away when the boomers acknowledge they fucked it up, they have to actually fix their shit.
You’re not allowed to talk about the '94 Crime Bill. You’re certainly not allowed to talk about the War on Drugs or the privatization of the modern prison industry.
Nobody ask where Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Ted Kennedy, and Tip O’Neal were when any of this shit got passed.
Absolutely and under no circumstances should you google who gave Strom Thurmond’s eulogy.
The legalization of cannabis in my state was brought about by activists, not Democratic Party members, and was passed by the public, which is made up of a majority of unaffiliated voters. Our Democratic governor vehemently opposed the measure. He did implement it when it passed, which Republican legislatures and governors have not done when similar bills were passed by the public in Republican states, though.
Red states are poised to increasingly embrace weed. Ohio is the latest, becoming the 24th state to legalize marijuana for recreational use via a voter referendum. This follows successful efforts in the past two years in Montana and Missouri. Fourteen states have legalized marijuana for medical use only.
Friendly reminder that literally all legalization legislation and referendums have come through the Democratic party.
Biden already pledged support. He needs youth vote. There’s literally no reason he wouldn’t unless he was blocked by Republicans…
… Which he is.
Yeah but some white kid doesn’t get to blaze it with their free unicorn pony so end of democracy over it we get!
I am lost at what you are trying to say here. Check the end of the sentence.
Phlubba might be referring to right wing youths who would hypothetically vote against Biden or not vote at all, cascading into a loss of US Democracy and eventually the fall of NATO and potentially democracy across the world as a whole. I don’t think our situation is necessarily that bad, but it’s definitely one of many possible futures.
What does this have to do with free unicorn ponies or the discussion at hand?
Ah, that would be a metaphor. “Blaze it with their free unicorn pony” is supposed to represent any unrealistic and fundamentally flawed policy goal that the aforementioned hypothetical children would be willing to risk the end of democracy if they do not obtain. Again, I don’t necessarily agree with their statement, but it at least is coherent enough.
He’s saying the only thing he ever says: having expectations of Democrats means you’re a spoiled child.
Ah — correction — having unreasonable expectations of Democrats in the face of immovable majority opposition, suggests you’re a spoiled child.
I meant exactly what I said. There is no correction needed.
Just because you falsely consider all criticism of Democrats to be unreasonable and all opposition to be immovable doesn’t make it so.
Well since you’re speaking for someone else, how about we just ask them who was closer to “what they meant” instead of just presuming with your blatant strawman?
$10 I’m closer.
“This user says criticism only comes from children” is much less of a strawman than their “unicorn ponies” garbage.
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When the fate of your entire legal system hinges on the cast of Pineapple Express showing up to vote for the correct candidate, democracy may have already ended and you just didn’t notice.
Fuck ur logic! We want outrage! D:<
Then why is one of his campaign promises written as: “As president he will decriminalize cannabis…”
Is his campaign promising things he doesn’t have the power to do?
Yes this is literally par for the course for every single presidential campaign in history.
They promise what they’ll do. They don’t say try to do because that’s been tested in marketing and certainty sounds better. Nevertheless it’s not Biden’s fault his agenda for what he’s been voted into office on is being blocked by the opposition for poor reasons.
The question isn’t why isn’t Biden doing this, the issue is why are Republicans blocking it and why aren’t you trying to convince them and their supporters?
If I can’t believe any of the good campaign promises from biden because everyone lies, why should we take the scary campaign promises of republicans seriously?
It really leads to apathy in the voter base.
For the same reason we take Biden seriously: Legalization has progressed in universally all blue states, has it not?
Ergo, you answered your own question: promises often come to fruition.
So let’s not risk letting Republican promises become reality, such as the promise of overturning Roe… Righhtttt?
It’s more like he’s bandwagoning something that now has popular support, without actually accomplishing much.
If he was serious he could reappoint DEA and other positions. Or an executive order to be challenged in court, etc.
Both Biden and his VP are on record as being anti marijuana before this last campaign. Biden as recently as when he was VP himself.
Bidens campaign has also fired or removed staffers for prior marijuana use.
Let’s review this as I’m seeing goalpost moving and circular reasoning present, forgetting curiously strange double-standards in where one directs their attention:
Yes, it’s pretty normal that popular things are often adopted by Presidential candidates. Kind of a no-brainer, don’t you think? As I said before: (1) It’s popular, and (2) Biden needs those youth voters. If it’s so popular, why isn’t Trump doing it? Why are Republicans so opposed? This finally begs the question: Why WOULDN’T Biden support it if he could? The answer is: there is no valid reason, which means Republicans are largely to blame while the workarounds are cumbersome and even run the risk of wasting time in front of the conservative Supreme Court, jeopordizing future attempts at decriminalization.
Politicians change minds. Legalization has become far more popular in recent times. At the end of the day, like it or not, Democrats and Biden are still the best pathways toward decriminalization. We certainly won’t get anything out of Trump and Republicans (which it strikes me as odd you tried to downplay Trump above).
At this point if it looks quacks and acts like a duck it probably is one. To bystanders reading this thread, this user demonstrates all classic signs of a right-wing operative intending to gaslight, sow defeatism, and wedge-drive Democrats.
You will see more of this, sadly.
Because its not true. There’s a Republican led bill introduced as recently as 2023.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/5977
I should clarify: laws that have actually passed.
Yet even so, you point to the edge-case exceptions while I point to the norm. For example, preceding the States Reform Act, Democrats beat them to the punch with the MORE Act, so your point is of such low-hanging fruit and the biggest exception – NOT TO MENTION – it literally won’t be brought to the floor for a vote thanks to none other than ® Mike Johnson…
… So your point?
Also, did you forget this? https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/10/06/statement-from-president-biden-on-marijuana-reform/
In effect, Biden has de-facto decriminalized Marijuana. Let me know if he prosecutes marijuana possession in legal states.
except you never addressed anything they said. youre acting just like trump cultists, where all evidence is fake anf theres always an excuse. its a bad look.
What did I not address? Pretty sure I addressed everything! If I missed something, let me know!
As is the number of grammatical mistakes I see. I recommend improving that in order to improve your ethos and legibility!
youre trying to make yourself sound rational here and its really starting yl break down, dude.
lolwut.
Indeed, I believe everyone should strive for rationality.
yes but you’re failing, while still wearing the aesthetics.
Because the scary promises have support from those currently in power and are therefore much more likely to be implemented. Nice promises of change with support from the people are far less likely because the they face not only resistance from the opposing party, but the people are easily propagandized (by those currently in power) to not vote or vote against their interests.
I dunno being visibly queer under trump didn’t feel worse than under biden.
the policies were worse but most people accepted that resisting the government was necessary. if its all that broken, this might actually be better.
maybe I’ll change my tune if the dems decide to run a candidate who isn’t dangling us over the ledge of fascism to appease his geriatric ego.
Where are you? I could mostly say the same thing living in a blue area, but I’m not willing to throw my LGBTQIA fam under the bus because I’m pissy about Democrats. Fascism is a silly threat being dangled by Biden, it’s a risk you and I take of being thrown in the oven.
yep!
I just don’t think biden will stop them from doing it, but his followers might make a fuss if he’s not president.
I’m really struggling to understand how you don’t understand how this works. I have to conclude you’re doing this in bad faith, given you implied your age is pretty high.
What part do I not understand?
That they aren’t promises but goals. The Biden administration (and about every administration) works towards everything they say they’ll do, how much they get done is determined by their majority and the willingness of the opposition to work with them.
https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/biden-promise-tracker/?ruling=true
Why use the word “promise” then? Is this Newspeak?
You’ve already been told this in an earlier reply by someone else.
President’s aren’t dictators, but they do have an amount of control of pushing for specific legislation, and the big “promises” are about trying to push this legislation.
Other promises can get stalled even if it’s within the president’s authority, like Biden’s student debt relief was stalled by the Supreme Court.
no but see it’s fine because he’s wearing a blue suit.
Because unlike in fairytales, in real life when bad guys try to do bad things, they usually win and come out on top.
Well, I don’t have a study backing me up, but in my experience, promising what you can’t deliver often results in being called a liar.
I really don’t know why “other candidates do it” would be an excuse. The whole pitch for voting for him is that he is supposed to be better than the other candidates. Seems like whataboutism.
Amazing how every sentence you said has its own bad premise and a skewed conclusion.
Don’t ask - I will not elaborate.
Someone just learned how politics work! Big day for you, huh?
It’s not really about how politics work. It is about how human minds work. The fact that making empty promises and then excuses is more effective than being honest shows one of the reasons why democracy isn’t a good system (although it may currently be the least bad).
And just accepting the lies probably makes it worse.
You might as well just not vote at all because not a single president will ever keep every campaign promise they make. Ever. You don’t have to like it but that’s reality and the only reason to be mad about it for one specific candidate over another is personal bias.
Obviously everyone should vote but unless you’re new to all of this you should already know to pick your battles. If campaign promises weren’t kept you should research it and know why before you complain about it.
Who says I am mad about it for one specific candidate? That is your bias showing there mate.
Excuses like roughly half of Americans oppose it and are shitheads?
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/11/22/americans-overwhelmingly-say-marijuana-should-be-legal-for-medical-or-recreational-use/
88% support legalization of marijuana, hell if you expand that to all drugs, 55% still support the decriminalization of all drugs
https://www.cato.org/blog/poll-55-americans-favor-decriminalizing-drugs
Only half are shitheads? (suprised pikachu)
On a more serious note: That would be a very good excuse if that wasn’t obvious already when he was making promises.
If his campaign promises had been worded as “we’ll try to do blank”, people would have criticized that, too.
I get what you’re saying on principle, but the reality is that the world does not work like that. There’s a reason populism is often a quick way to get to power, because you just promise whatever people want to hear so you could be elected. People don’t vote based on logic, people vote based on emotion, which means people don’t consider what is realistic, they consider what speaks to them.
You say it as if it was a good thing and not something we should strive to change.
What gave you that impression?
A president can do almost NOTHING unilaterally. What they’re promising you is what they’ll support if it makes it to their desk. This is how checks and balances work… if you want to vote for someone who has sworn to be as shitty as possible because the guy who swore to do things you want can’t just snap his fingers and make it happen, I guess nobody can stop you…
What you’re finding is that the Democratic party is still interested in a functioning government where people don’t just vote the party line like a borg - which results in more difficulty passing legislation. Unfortunately, “both sides same” isn’t remotely accurate which you’re finding out.
Memory of a goldfish.
Friendly reminder that mass incarceration was a bipartisan effort going back 4 decades.
Irrelevant. Read again, except this time more closely.
What matters is who changed first.
Democrats.
Democrats changed first.
As, in recent history preceding the great ideological shifts of party banners, they always do.
How old are you?
A lot of us consider 1994 to be pretty recent but maybe not to the younger crowd
Does it really matter to the point being made?
Oh man, how far we’ve come in 30 years. I really am quite proud of the Democratic party.
On the flipside, Republicans have if anything continued to regress.
Idk? What point is being made? That Democrats took a modest aesthetic step toward fixing a problem they helped create? A problem that runs much deeper than the scheduling of drugs and a problem that destroyed entire communities of color?
I’m not interested in engaging in a debate with you, I just think it’s important to recognize the depth of the issues being discussed and be skeptical of the accomplishments being touted during an election year.
Being the sole gateway through which Marijuana legalization has occurred is a, “modest aesthetic”?
LOL.
Of course you’re not interested, because you know you’ve got nothing. And yet, here you are.
What an incredibly shallow understanding of a deeply impactful issue.
My thoughts exactly.
But then really, what more is there to get?
Asking how old someone is completely defeats the purpose. We’ve seen how boomers mishandled things and pulled the ladders up behind them so let’s not pretend that being old and remembering 1994 “like it was pretty recent” (it wasn’t) makes your opinion in any way superior.
It’s relevant and recent when the majority of the legislators who passed the law are still in congress
That’s exactly my point. We’re still living in the reality of laws passed by boomers - hell, we’re still being governed by them. That reality doesn’t just go away when the boomers acknowledge they fucked it up, they have to actually fix their shit.
but they haven’t changed, and if they want my vote at this point, after the shit they pulled, they basically need to go down on me.
Nobody ask who co-sponsored the '94 Crime Bill.
You’re not allowed to talk about the '94 Crime Bill. You’re certainly not allowed to talk about the War on Drugs or the privatization of the modern prison industry.
Nobody ask where Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Ted Kennedy, and Tip O’Neal were when any of this shit got passed.
Absolutely and under no circumstances should you google who gave Strom Thurmond’s eulogy.
The legalization of cannabis in my state was brought about by activists, not Democratic Party members, and was passed by the public, which is made up of a majority of unaffiliated voters. Our Democratic governor vehemently opposed the measure. He did implement it when it passed, which Republican legislatures and governors have not done when similar bills were passed by the public in Republican states, though.
Curious of the state but I’m willing to bet money >90% of those activists were, conveniently, voting Democrats or of the Democratic coalition.
This is generally reflected in public polling: https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2024/03/26/most-americans-favor-legalizing-marijuana-for-medical-recreational-use/#:~:text=62%25 of conservative and moderate,Democrats (84%25) say this.
Finally, conservatives are starting to come around but they’re always behind the curve.
https://www.kiplinger.com/politics/red-states-embrace-marijuana-the-kiplinger-letter
Yep, you can thank blue states and democratic activists for paving the way years ahead of anyone.
… Eventually reds trail behind.
Edit: Also I’m willing to bet those referendums in those red states were petitioned largely by left-wing Democratic-caucus members.