This doesn’t require single family housing on giant lots. Just well built buildings with proper insulation and sound proofing. I used to think apartments were just noisy until my partner and I moved into our current place. I live on the top floor of a 2 building, 6 unit complex of loft apartments cascading down the side of a hill. The buildings had to be built to withstand the extremely strong winds from the bay, and as such they’re solid as fuck.
Despite our downstairs being tile floor our neighbors have told us they haven’t heard any noise from us at all. My partner and I started being less concerned about noise and began playing somewhat loud music frequently and yell to each other across the unit. Despite this our downstairs neighbors still haven’t heard a peep from us. For a while I genuinely thought our neighbors were just trying to be nice as everyone in our complex is super friendly and gets along well.
One day our neighbor in the adjacent building was woodworking in his garage. Normally the noise wouldn’t bother me, but I was focused on something so I shut the window facing the courtyard which made me realize just how soundproof this giant concrete building is, both between units and to the outside world. I couldn’t hear our neighbors saw unless I opened the curtains and tried to hear it, otherwise it might as well have been very faint background noise. I really wish buildings like this were the norm for apartments because they provide all the privacy of a single family home with all the benefits of apartment buildings.
Thanks! The whole street we live on are similar units and they’re genuinely awesome. Everyone has balconies for plants, and if you want to chill in some grass there are great parks within a 10 minute walk. They would definitely pose a problem for the less able bodied, but the hills of San Francisco aren’t very friendly either. Our unit is one of the two at ground level so groceries aren’t a problem, but we don’t have a car so grocery trips are frequent and small anyway (we also run a HelloFresh discount scheme). Highly recommend giant concrete buildings. They’re a little industrial looking but damn are they great.
We lived in a townhome before actually and it was pretty good as well, but the sound proofing just wasn’t there unfortunately. Not awful but nothing compared to our current place.
Places like this are only expensive in the first place because everyone builds single family homes that use up tons of space. Then we run out of land and the price of everything skyrockets and only then do cities start building vertical. This is largely the problem with affordable housing in the US, but we can’t have property values go down because real estate has become an alternative stock market I guess.
Issue is, these US-style lawns are often mandated in ways they disallow most other things, unless you want hefty fines.
I’m in Europe, and at least I can have little flowers within the grass, can plant any trees as long as they won’t damage any buildings or cables, and otherwise I can customize my own garden. I could even plant vegetables if the dogs didn’t stamp it, and wouldn’t be so cheap and readily available in the supermarket it doesn’t worth to look after them (once I did grew chili in pots since they’re more scarce in the supermarket).
nah this is just modern isolationist propaganda, people have lived without “privacy” for millions of years and were clearly happier for it.
People nowadays think they want privacy, when in fact they’ve just been robbed of closeness to others during their childhood and never learned to deal with having other people close to them. Like for fuck’s sake in the US it’s completely normal to put infants in a completely separate room! It’s inhumane!
Humans are profoundly social animals and thrive when surrounded by others, we are literally living in an officially recognized loneliness epidemic that is harming our physical and mental health.
Yeah I think a lot of that is true but I grew up in apartments and never want to go back to that, luckily we were able to split a house with my wife’s parents so we still share a wall but it’s with family and that is definitely better than random people, plus having some space where you can grow some plants or let your dogs run around is amazing. I wish my and my friends would have gotten together and bought a big pie e of land where we built our homes on and lived together I think that would be really cool
Lawns are a result of setback requirements imposed because people were building structures right up to and sometimes over the street.
Yeah, a garden is better than a lawn but most people don’t have the time or care to maintain that. Much easier to just have a mono “crop” that can be relatively easily managed.
I said more easily. It’s relative. Also, clover and moss are super location/climate specific. What grows natively in Detroit is going to be much different than Miami or reno or jersey city.
Depends on your location and what type of grass you utilize. I for one live in the central plains and have native buffalo grass in the front yard.
I don’t have to water it, I mow it down about twice a year, and buffalo grass flowers which is great for my leaf cutter bees.
Grass isn’t inherently a problem, the problem is most people only plant grass that isn’t native to their locality. Something like buffalo grass is arguably more beneficial to the environment than planting a garden that requires more nutrients and water than the local environment can provide.
It’s basically the only thing keeping the top soil in any great plains region from blowing away. Buffalo grass in particular is super important at controlling erosion, their roots go down several feet compared to the few inches turf grass provides.
We need more multifamily homes, but I sincerely think that green spaces are super important, not only for the environment, but for the community as well. There’s no reason people who live in multifamily units shouldn’t have access to green spaces or gardens.
We need more multifamily homes, but I sincerely think that green spaces are super important, not only for the environment, but for the community as well. There’s no reason people who live in multifamily units shouldn’t have access to green spaces or gardens.
Agreed, they just should be public spaces, instead of everyone having their individual lawn that they don’t know how to utilise in the best way.
Height clearance for emergency vehicles (“over the road”), utility servicing, having space to actually have a fire hydrant is important, fire breaks, etc
All that stuff should be accommodated for in the public right-of-way (which includes more than the paved part of the street itself, and usually ends somewhere in the vicinity of the outside edge of the sidewalk). It still doesn’t persuade me that we need setbacks in the private property beyond that.
![[meme] Lawns and car storage — name a more wasteful use of land](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/c6a93d55-ab0b-4275-bd92-43931e7b7d77.jpeg){kind=link}
Decorative open space is important for making cities livable but uh… lawns ain’t it.
Also nice to have space between your neighbors for privacy and mental health
This doesn’t require single family housing on giant lots. Just well built buildings with proper insulation and sound proofing. I used to think apartments were just noisy until my partner and I moved into our current place. I live on the top floor of a 2 building, 6 unit complex of loft apartments cascading down the side of a hill. The buildings had to be built to withstand the extremely strong winds from the bay, and as such they’re solid as fuck.
Despite our downstairs being tile floor our neighbors have told us they haven’t heard any noise from us at all. My partner and I started being less concerned about noise and began playing somewhat loud music frequently and yell to each other across the unit. Despite this our downstairs neighbors still haven’t heard a peep from us. For a while I genuinely thought our neighbors were just trying to be nice as everyone in our complex is super friendly and gets along well.
One day our neighbor in the adjacent building was woodworking in his garage. Normally the noise wouldn’t bother me, but I was focused on something so I shut the window facing the courtyard which made me realize just how soundproof this giant concrete building is, both between units and to the outside world. I couldn’t hear our neighbors saw unless I opened the curtains and tried to hear it, otherwise it might as well have been very faint background noise. I really wish buildings like this were the norm for apartments because they provide all the privacy of a single family home with all the benefits of apartment buildings.
Removed by mod
I mean, if you want to be privileged not to use stairs, once the housing gets dense enough they start putting in elevators…
Removed by mod
Thanks! The whole street we live on are similar units and they’re genuinely awesome. Everyone has balconies for plants, and if you want to chill in some grass there are great parks within a 10 minute walk. They would definitely pose a problem for the less able bodied, but the hills of San Francisco aren’t very friendly either. Our unit is one of the two at ground level so groceries aren’t a problem, but we don’t have a car so grocery trips are frequent and small anyway (we also run a HelloFresh discount scheme). Highly recommend giant concrete buildings. They’re a little industrial looking but damn are they great.
We lived in a townhome before actually and it was pretty good as well, but the sound proofing just wasn’t there unfortunately. Not awful but nothing compared to our current place.
This is when we find out rent is $4000/month
Places like this are only expensive in the first place because everyone builds single family homes that use up tons of space. Then we run out of land and the price of everything skyrockets and only then do cities start building vertical. This is largely the problem with affordable housing in the US, but we can’t have property values go down because real estate has become an alternative stock market I guess.
Issue is, these US-style lawns are often mandated in ways they disallow most other things, unless you want hefty fines.
I’m in Europe, and at least I can have little flowers within the grass, can plant any trees as long as they won’t damage any buildings or cables, and otherwise I can customize my own garden. I could even plant vegetables if the dogs didn’t stamp it, and wouldn’t be so cheap and readily available in the supermarket it doesn’t worth to look after them (once I did grew chili in pots since they’re more scarce in the supermarket).
nah this is just modern isolationist propaganda, people have lived without “privacy” for millions of years and were clearly happier for it.
People nowadays think they want privacy, when in fact they’ve just been robbed of closeness to others during their childhood and never learned to deal with having other people close to them. Like for fuck’s sake in the US it’s completely normal to put infants in a completely separate room! It’s inhumane!
Humans are profoundly social animals and thrive when surrounded by others, we are literally living in an officially recognized loneliness epidemic that is harming our physical and mental health.
Yeah I think a lot of that is true but I grew up in apartments and never want to go back to that, luckily we were able to split a house with my wife’s parents so we still share a wall but it’s with family and that is definitely better than random people, plus having some space where you can grow some plants or let your dogs run around is amazing. I wish my and my friends would have gotten together and bought a big pie e of land where we built our homes on and lived together I think that would be really cool
Lawns are a result of setback requirements imposed because people were building structures right up to and sometimes over the street.
Yeah, a garden is better than a lawn but most people don’t have the time or care to maintain that. Much easier to just have a mono “crop” that can be relatively easily managed.
Easily managed???
If that were the goal it’d be clover and moss. No mow lawns are the easiest to manage.
Grasses are a huge pain, and simply there because British aristocracy had a hard on for them and we never questioned if it was smart.
I said more easily. It’s relative. Also, clover and moss are super location/climate specific. What grows natively in Detroit is going to be much different than Miami or reno or jersey city.
I lived in Jersey City for maybe a decade. I think the only two native plants are those trees that smell like cum, and fire hydrants.
aww cmon you don’t like the cum tree everybody loves the cum tree
Some bastard planted those trees all over my city.
Every spring smells like the aftermath of a pride parade.
Especially because British aristocracy was living in Britain, a pretty rainy place, which helps immensely in cultivating grass
Depends on your location and what type of grass you utilize. I for one live in the central plains and have native buffalo grass in the front yard.
I don’t have to water it, I mow it down about twice a year, and buffalo grass flowers which is great for my leaf cutter bees.
Grass isn’t inherently a problem, the problem is most people only plant grass that isn’t native to their locality. Something like buffalo grass is arguably more beneficial to the environment than planting a garden that requires more nutrients and water than the local environment can provide.
I always wondered that grass had to be natural to somewhere
All the “normal” lawn grasses in the US are native to Europe or Asia.
It’s basically the only thing keeping the top soil in any great plains region from blowing away. Buffalo grass in particular is super important at controlling erosion, their roots go down several feet compared to the few inches turf grass provides.
We need more multifamily homes, but I sincerely think that green spaces are super important, not only for the environment, but for the community as well. There’s no reason people who live in multifamily units shouldn’t have access to green spaces or gardens.
Agreed, they just should be public spaces, instead of everyone having their individual lawn that they don’t know how to utilise in the best way.
And that’s a problem because…?
Height clearance for emergency vehicles (“over the road”), utility servicing, having space to actually have a fire hydrant is important, fire breaks, etc
All that stuff should be accommodated for in the public right-of-way (which includes more than the paved part of the street itself, and usually ends somewhere in the vicinity of the outside edge of the sidewalk). It still doesn’t persuade me that we need setbacks in the private property beyond that.
Exactly, setbacks are classic NIMBY (NIMFY?) bullshit.
How can you build anything without a permit? Man, America is weird AF…
Nor is advocating getting rid of gardens.