• TheTechnician27
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      2 months ago

      Oh yeah, I’m sure any of these cases were someone stopping to hold an active shooter at gunpoint and that somehow working out for them. Or maybe they used their gun as a melee weapon. Or maybe the attackers were subdued by being talked down over their common love of guns. Or maybe the active shooter ran out of ammo and came up to the good guy with a gun to get some more, at which point the good guy revealed they were actually tricking them into lowering their guard and put them into a headlock. Or maybe some other far-fetched bullshit that’ll let me equivocate over the fact that “good guys with guns” don’t do shit in the grand scheme of things.

        • TheTechnician27
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          2 months ago

          I think you’re pissed at the objective fact that 12/433 is fucking nothing and your “good guy with a gun” argument is a pathetic farce, so you’re trying muddy the waters by shifting the argument to a ridiculous, unfounded, unfalsifiable notion that any of the 42 subduers might’ve had literally anything to do with “good guys” having firearms.

            • TheTechnician27
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              182 months ago

              Yeah, so terrible and confusing that they didn’t mention guns in branches that don’t have anything to do with guns outside of a gun fetishist’s fanfiction.

              • queermunist she/her
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                2 months ago

                So, I can imagine someone with a gun menacing the attacker at gunpoint and forcing them to surrender. No shots fired.

                But the data doesn’t include this for bystanders. Maybe that’s because it doesn’t happen in real life, or maybe they muddied the watters. We can’t know because we can’t see the data they used to make this graphic.

                • @[email protected]
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                  32 months ago

                  For practical purposes imagine yourself in a public area with the gunman actively shooting people with an AR-15, to the left of you a guys head is turned to mush, down the way someone takes a hit to a limb leaving their arm dangling in an unnatural way. All around you are dead and dying you ignore the pistol in your pocket and run at him screaming “I’m going to take you down brudder”.

                  The people who subdued people without shooting them probably didn’t have a gun.

                  • queermunist she/her
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                    12 months ago

                    Not all shooters are blindly suicidal. They can be menaced with a gun and told to surrender. Yeah, in some situations it won’t work, but in some situations it will.

                    42 incidents. Not even one of them used a gun to force a surrender? Hard to believe.

            • Lev_Astov
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              2 months ago

              Thank you for standing up to the slavering morons around here about bad statistical graphics.

              All I’m getting out of this is that police are, in fact less than 50% effective, so we’d better plan on dealing with it ourselves.

    • Annoyed_🦀
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      82 months ago

      True, they didn’t specify whether in that 42 cases the citizen does have a gun but did not fire, just aiming and intimidate. However the data did split between shot fired shot at the attacker(no mention hit or miss) vs subdued, not killed vs subdued, and also there’s a mention of the attacker surrender, so i assume “subdued” mean the attacker did not surrender but forced to give up whatever they’re doing.

    • @[email protected]
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      52 months ago

      The chance that someone decided to go hand to hand with a gunman in the middle of blowing away the population whilst leaving their gun holstered is basically zero.