“They fell for the con” seems harsh and inaccurate.
Everyone knew Trump was lying with his promises. But Dems couldn’t even be bothered to offer empty promises. If your only options are someone who openly doesn’t give a shit about you, or someone who pretends to (even though they’re probably lying), you’re better off taking a chance on the lie.
The person who is upfront about it can be reasoned with. The liar is never going to be trustworthy.
If the guy at the train station lies and tells me that the train will be here in an hour I waste an hour. If he tells me the train has been cancelled I know to make another plan.
I don’t know. Expecting people to go along with a system that’s literally killing them seems way more privileged. You must not be suffering under the current status quo.
Actually, that’s exactly my point. Blue MAGA acts shocked people don’t want to bury their heads in the sand with them, and expects the rest of us to stop complaining and just eat the spit.
What? How am I being smug by just pointing out that falling for a con is… Falling for a con? Trump is a well, well, well documented con man. Like… Maybe the most well documented con man ever. It’s really hard to feel bad for anyone who voted for him getting screwed over.
To be clear, I don’t blame people who fall for scams or cons. I did say it’s hard to feel bad for Trump voters specifically, but that’s a pretty special circumstance as I tried to describe.
All I said was that falling for a scam or con is falling for a scam or con.
Except they had some coherent and sound policy? A lot if it is way too status quo or populist when that clearly isnt working.
Trump has some sound policy too (as much as Lemmy would hate to admit it), but its also filled with obvious leapord face eating proposals, even if you 100% believe him.
And its not like he hasn’t been president already, albeit much more restrained before.
Thats the most baffling thing about Trump support to me… There’s this hope, this fantasy he’s the change we need when we have no other choice, when that is absolutely not true if you look at his cabinet, history, and policy. He’s a grifter even if you look at hus history before politics. Why does he get the benefit of the doubt?
Dems just still believe they’re entitled to the working class vote, and aren’t willing to offer anything to earn it. Still the failed Clinton strategy of skipping them over, but counting on their votes anyway.
Uh, how about not giving the rich massive tax breaks and rocketing the national debt even higher so quickly? Anti inflation measures, support for higher wages? Actual support for unions, as tepid as it may be? Attempts to relieve debt? Let’s start with that.
What exactly do you think Trump is even theoretically bringing that Dems aren’t?
Wait, so now they have “vague and empty promises”? I thought they couldn’t even be bothered to lie, and had nothing to offer, making a con-man preferable?
I kinda feel like you’re just more mad at Democrats than you are at Republicans who are actually doing bad things.
Yes, I am more mad at Democrats than Republicans. They’re both doing bad things, but the Dems are the ones trying to pretend they’re not and claiming they represent our interests. Doing what Dems have always done, and absorbing leftist energy to actively prevent change.
Because the party has become completely focused on high dollar salaries for the consultants running these campaigns. And they wonder why that doesn’t translate into victory.
What about pro-union congressional bills that are being blocked by Republicans?
What exactly is the Republican coherent and sound policy? Because the one I’ve seen is largely union-busting and cutting regulations on businesses. Democrats have definitely failed to show the work they’re doing and show how Republicans have fought tooth and nail to block and roll back worker protections, but it is entirely disingenuous to claim Dems “openly don’t give a shit about you.”
If your only options are someone who openly doesn’t give a shit about you, or someone who pretends to (even though they’re probably lying), you’re better off taking a chance on the lie.
There. Where you say republicans are probably lying but you’re better off taking a chance on a lie. If you hold both parties to a different standard to the detriment of one, you’re supporting one of those parties over the other.
You’re right critical thinking is hard for people, but it’s still a con and they still fell for it.
If you know the political process is filled with liars and your only options is someone that doesn’t want to make overblown statements that are clearly lies and someone that does lie (you know this because of his past lies) then you should have picked the person that lies the least.
Not necessarily. They didn’t need to believe it in order to consider it the least bad option.
Dems are still riding with the Clinton “basket of deplorables” failed strategy. They openly and outwardly despise any voters that aren’t white collar liberals. And y’all have the gall to criticize these people for not jumping onboard with a party who proudly hates them. Unbelievably obtuse.
Unless you care about literally nothing else, that doesn’t make the two parties equal. Trump is more enthusiastic about that anyways and has actively sabotaged Biden’s ceasefire attempts and said he would destroy Palestine entirely. It’s pretty close though tbh considering Biden keeps sending weapons. I wish the dems would just man up and back out of there
I care about plenty of other things, too. The climate, income inequality, homelessness rates, hunger rates, corporate greed, the out of control military industrial complex, immigration reform, prison industrial complex, etc. The Dems and GOP are equal on all of that. Genocide is just the worst thing imaginable, so it’s the subject most worth mentioning.
Dems might have slightly better rhetoric, but people can’t eat promises.
Wile not “both sides” as one side is obviously worse, the democrats did actively work against unions during Biden’s presidency. And sure Biden made talk about passing PRO, which he failed to do, but he also forced terms on the rail unions, and made it illegal for them to strike, and thus making the rail union forever powerless to fight for its members, and dooming it to obsolescence
I ain’t going to bother trying to defend democrats from how terrible they are, but it’s no contest as to which is worse objectively. It’s not even close.
Yep. The libs here just don’t have a clue. Probably because they only want idealism, when they should study materialism and evolutionary game theory. Or human nature in general.
“They fell for the con” seems harsh and inaccurate.
Everyone knew Trump was lying with his promises. But Dems couldn’t even be bothered to offer empty promises. If your only options are someone who openly doesn’t give a shit about you, or someone who pretends to (even though they’re probably lying), you’re better off taking a chance on the lie.
If a con man offers me the world, and you offer me nothing, and I listen to the con man… I’ve still fallen for the con, my guy.
Not really. You just chose the least shitty option you were being forced into.
But I understand acknowledging that would interfere with your ability to feel smug.
How is a lie ‘the least shitty option?’
Because it’s a binary choice where the other option is someone not even willing to pretend they’ll help you.
Still a bad option.
The person who is upfront about it can be reasoned with. The liar is never going to be trustworthy.
If the guy at the train station lies and tells me that the train will be here in an hour I waste an hour. If he tells me the train has been cancelled I know to make another plan.
A better example would be a waiter who spits on your sandwich in the kitchen vs one who’ll spit on it after they drop it off at the table.
Your best choice is to burn down the diner.
Nothing says ‘privilege’ more than people who talk about burning the system down.
It’s like the guys who have never been in a fight are always ready to see other people go at it.
I don’t know. Expecting people to go along with a system that’s literally killing them seems way more privileged. You must not be suffering under the current status quo.
Even your own example doesn’t prove your point. I’d rather someone spit in my food where I can see it and ignore it.
Actually, that’s exactly my point. Blue MAGA acts shocked people don’t want to bury their heads in the sand with them, and expects the rest of us to stop complaining and just eat the spit.
What? How am I being smug by just pointing out that falling for a con is… Falling for a con? Trump is a well, well, well documented con man. Like… Maybe the most well documented con man ever. It’s really hard to feel bad for anyone who voted for him getting screwed over.
Love the ‘how am I being smug?!’ followed by the classic smug victim blaming.
Both Dem and GOP supporters are being conned. Neither of you are in a position to be pointing fingers at the other.
To be clear, I don’t blame people who fall for scams or cons. I did say it’s hard to feel bad for Trump voters specifically, but that’s a pretty special circumstance as I tried to describe.
All I said was that falling for a scam or con is falling for a scam or con.
Yeah. That’s called ‘being smug.’ Especially if you just voted for the other fascist.
Why do you presume to know who I voted for? Or that I’m even American?
I really don’t think we share the same definition of smug. Have a good day.
Except they had some coherent and sound policy? A lot if it is way too status quo or populist when that clearly isnt working.
Trump has some sound policy too (as much as Lemmy would hate to admit it), but its also filled with obvious leapord face eating proposals, even if you 100% believe him.
And its not like he hasn’t been president already, albeit much more restrained before.
Thats the most baffling thing about Trump support to me… There’s this hope, this fantasy he’s the change we need when we have no other choice, when that is absolutely not true if you look at his cabinet, history, and policy. He’s a grifter even if you look at hus history before politics. Why does he get the benefit of the doubt?
What was their coherent and sound policy?
Dems just still believe they’re entitled to the working class vote, and aren’t willing to offer anything to earn it. Still the failed Clinton strategy of skipping them over, but counting on their votes anyway.
Uh, how about not giving the rich massive tax breaks and rocketing the national debt even higher so quickly? Anti inflation measures, support for higher wages? Actual support for unions, as tepid as it may be? Attempts to relieve debt? Let’s start with that.
What exactly do you think Trump is even theoretically bringing that Dems aren’t?
The Dems were not offering anything like that. You’re pulling that out of your ass.
I didn’t say Trump was better. The Dems and GOP are two sides of the same fascist coin. We have to defeat them both.
Those were the basics of Harris’s platform. Tax the wealthy, support unions, tamper inflation.
No, it wasn’t. There were some vague and empty promises, but that kinda thing is a hard sell when you’re already in power and not doing those things.
Wait, so now they have “vague and empty promises”? I thought they couldn’t even be bothered to lie, and had nothing to offer, making a con-man preferable?
I kinda feel like you’re just more mad at Democrats than you are at Republicans who are actually doing bad things.
Yes, I am more mad at Democrats than Republicans. They’re both doing bad things, but the Dems are the ones trying to pretend they’re not and claiming they represent our interests. Doing what Dems have always done, and absorbing leftist energy to actively prevent change.
Yeah it was funny to me having kamala literally copy-paste biden’s 2nd term agenda and then talk about the things she’d do when she’s in charge.
I’m like, yo aren’t you VP? Maybe get bidens ear, get started now, put some skin in the game?
When it’s time to mend the social safety net, Dems have this ongoing act, like they’re always on the campaign and not in power.
Because the party has become completely focused on high dollar salaries for the consultants running these campaigns. And they wonder why that doesn’t translate into victory.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2021/04/26/executive-order-on-worker-organizing-and-empowerment/
Do executive orders count?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protecting_the_Right_to_Organize_Act
What about pro-union congressional bills that are being blocked by Republicans?
What exactly is the Republican coherent and sound policy? Because the one I’ve seen is largely union-busting and cutting regulations on businesses. Democrats have definitely failed to show the work they’re doing and show how Republicans have fought tooth and nail to block and roll back worker protections, but it is entirely disingenuous to claim Dems “openly don’t give a shit about you.”
When did I imply Republicans have anything better? Gonna blow your mind here: criticism of Dems is not support of Republicans.
No, I’m not satisfied with symbolic efforts from Dems. Clearly, most of the country isn’t either.
There. Where you say republicans are probably lying but you’re better off taking a chance on a lie. If you hold both parties to a different standard to the detriment of one, you’re supporting one of those parties over the other.
You’re projecting your binary worldview onto me. Only way you could interpret it that way.
You’ve been projecting the insides of your asshole all over this fucking thread.
Shut up fuck off and stop pulling shit out if that gaping barn door of an ass while lying through your fucking teeth.
Y’all get so offended by any criticism of the Blue MAGA cult. Wild you can so smugly laugh at the Red MAGA cult at the same time. No self-awareness.
Oops! Did a lib scratch themselves on the sharp end of their acumen?
lmaooo
Take your meds bro.
You’re right critical thinking is hard for people, but it’s still a con and they still fell for it.
If you know the political process is filled with liars and your only options is someone that doesn’t want to make overblown statements that are clearly lies and someone that does lie (you know this because of his past lies) then you should have picked the person that lies the least.
Not necessarily. They didn’t need to believe it in order to consider it the least bad option.
Dems are still riding with the Clinton “basket of deplorables” failed strategy. They openly and outwardly despise any voters that aren’t white collar liberals. And y’all have the gall to criticize these people for not jumping onboard with a party who proudly hates them. Unbelievably obtuse.
That’s not what “basket of deplorables” meant
K. Tell me what you think it means.
It’s referring to the subset of republicans that are openly evil, not just people who “aren’t white collar liberals”
The mental gymnastics here are insane
Not nearly as insane as expecting people you’ll do nothing for to help you get elected.
That’s not the same thing as saying that republicans are better because they’re lying to you while giving you worse policies lmao
No one said that.
“you’re better off taking a chance on the lie.”
I guess you didn’t technically say that republicans have worse policies, but… please don’t tell me you believe they’re even comparable
Oh they’re not comparable? Which party isn’t supporting genocide right now?
Unless you care about literally nothing else, that doesn’t make the two parties equal. Trump is more enthusiastic about that anyways and has actively sabotaged Biden’s ceasefire attempts and said he would destroy Palestine entirely. It’s pretty close though tbh considering Biden keeps sending weapons. I wish the dems would just man up and back out of there
I care about plenty of other things, too. The climate, income inequality, homelessness rates, hunger rates, corporate greed, the out of control military industrial complex, immigration reform, prison industrial complex, etc. The Dems and GOP are equal on all of that. Genocide is just the worst thing imaginable, so it’s the subject most worth mentioning.
Dems might have slightly better rhetoric, but people can’t eat promises.
Wile not “both sides” as one side is obviously worse, the democrats did actively work against unions during Biden’s presidency. And sure Biden made talk about passing PRO, which he failed to do, but he also forced terms on the rail unions, and made it illegal for them to strike, and thus making the rail union forever powerless to fight for its members, and dooming it to obsolescence
Which side is obviously worse?
I thought we established long ago that committing a genocide is the worst thing anyone can possibly do. And they both are doing that.
One promises to do it better.
They both do. They’re both lying.
I ain’t going to bother trying to defend democrats from how terrible they are, but it’s no contest as to which is worse objectively. It’s not even close.
Depends if you judge politicians by their promises or their actions.
I judge their actions, and the parties are nearly identical by that measure.
Good thing i get to judge the whole republican party by their actions then
You’re supposed to be doing that for all parties and politicians. This is what makes you an easy mark for the Dems.
Yep. The libs here just don’t have a clue. Probably because they only want idealism, when they should study materialism and evolutionary game theory. Or human nature in general.