This post is generally fine but don’t forget that figure skating and Iowa are both pretty fucking cool and produce some pretty important figures im their own right, many being POC:
- Debi Thomas, Black American figure skater, first African American to win the women’s singles title at the U.S. Figure Skating Championships in 1986 and the World Figure Skating Championships in the same year.
- Tai Babilonia, the first figure skater of partial African American descent to compete for the United States at an Olympics and win world titles. She is also part Filipino on her father’s side and part Native American.
- Ako Abdul-Samad, Black American Iowa State Representative since 2007. Established and directed business functions that include employment assistance, support services, health care management, community development, advocacy, and consultancy on culture and diversity education.
- George Washington Carver, a Black American agricultural scientist, generally regarded as an American here for his work especially in nutrition and soil depletion. Spent a good chunk of his career at Iowa State University.
- Carrie Chapman Catt, another ISU alum, who played a critical role in passing the 19th Amendment, giving women the right to vote.
And now would you like to explain what those minority people’s experiences were like, participating in figure skating and/or living in Iowa?
Go on. In your own words. Give us a broad overview of what that would be like.
Hint, to everyone: if it’s an honest depiction, it’s going to involve A LOT OF ANNOYING CRACKERS.
I’m just saying, man, I wasn’t trying to erase non-whites in either figure skating or Iowa. The butt of the joke is the fact that THOSE INSTITUTIONS ARE STILL SO OVERWHELMINGLY WHITE THAT IT’S LITERALLY A PROBLEM, ESPECIALLY IF YOU’RE NOT WHITE.
This is friendly fire that you’re engaging in.
EDIT: I mean, Jesus fucking Christ, I used the words “A BUNCH OF ANNOYING CRACKERS” in the meme. What are the odds that I’m a fucking white supremacist, over here?
Don’t worry OP, I’m an actual POC and speaking on behalf of all POCs (I’m not), your post was very funny and not erasure. It’s important to celebrate IBPOC achievements but many of our experiences to getting those achievements in predominately white spaces are in fact “oh fuck, a bunch of annoying crackers”
Thanks. You know who REALLY got burned, during this whole exchange? The airlines. Nobody wanted to defend them. Everyone comes together, in a true spirit of pan-ethnic harmony, when it comes to shitting on air travel.
thank you for this comment it changed my perspective slightly, genuinely. :)
i just don’t know. the post still seems to have an excessive hate boner for the artistry of these inspirational Black American performers, what with the “easier to enjoy drunk” and all. im trying to put myself in the shoes of a young POC performer being absolutely incredible and thriving against the odds in this white dominated space in 2024, and if i saw my contribution to the world being compared to airplane food? i would have to guess i’d be pissed.
this meme is insulting in a way that #oscarssowhite is not. i can see why my take on it is controversial and i definitely have nothing against OP. anyway thanks again.
post participates in erasure of non-white individuals and their accomplishments.
don’t forget you put the word “just” before your phrase “a bunch of annoying crackers.” aka, there is nothing else. erasure.
erasure of POC accomplishment perpetuates white supremacy.
not accusing you of being a white suprmacist, i’m accusing your post of it.
fuck this post 👍i am internally ambient about this post though i acknowledge it has positive rhetorical goals.So when the “#OscarsSoWhite” hashtag was going around, did you jump on those people, because they were erasing the already-existing accomplishments of Black actors and writers?
Please answer this question. I’m asking it 100 percent seriously.
I’m basically saying “#FigureSkatingSoWhite” and “#IowaSoWhite,” and they OBJECTIVELY STILL ARE. That’s a fact. And I’m not defending that fact. I’m lampooning it.
And yet you’re attacking me. So, I ask again: can I safely assume that you also attacked everyone who pointed out that the Academy Awards (and Hollywood in general) are still extremely whited out?
glad to see i agree with your position just find a better way to say it this meme sucks reads like a racist elon tweet
reads like a racist elon tweet
See, I find this take unironically fascinating, because I actually, truly expected some Elon fanboys to show up in this thread, attacking me for using a “slur” against white people, and crying “bigotry against any people is wrong” at my implication that there are too many white people in Iowa.
I genuinely still expect that might happen.
So if they do show up, I guess you can fight with them about whether my post is anti-white or anti-black. I’ll just be depressed. All I know for sure is that Elon himself would NEVER be caught implying that there are too many white people ANYWHERE. Not even as the most lighthearted of jokes (not that he has a sense of humor, anyway).
I hope you can at least fully agree with that.
okay this makes sense, apologies if i am coming off as acerbic i just clearly see this post as being more of an attack than other people are finding it. making an effort to understand your perspective here
what is your defense of comparing figure skating to airplane food and calling it shitty unless drunk? i guess if this post didn’t mention those two elements i might not have had the knee jerk reaction i did, but that language is pretty insulting to a performance art which i find to be actually incredibly beautiful and moving? (speaking to your example of #oscarssowhite, no id never jump down its throat because it does not attack the art as a whole, where this meme does.) and i guess i am basing this off other historical performance arts where people of color as dismissed for their contributions simply for existing in a perceived white space.
for example, rock-n-roll, being a vast majority white space despite literally being founded by Black American artists. from what i understand, the historical demonization of rock came out of racism, demonization of Black people, to such a degree that when rock finally reached mainstream the Black artists who had founded the sound were all but surgically removed from history, and laughed at for “failing to hold on to” what they created.
does insulting the artists of figure skating as a whole because of its whiteness not also devalue the Black community within it to you? your trivialization of Asian individuals in the scene also perhaps contributes to my perception that you think these people’s participation are an accident, or somehow “don’t count.”
whatever you answer, i’ll retract my original criticisms and apologize. 9/10 meme with the only point off because i think figure skating is actually pretty fucking dope. :)
edit: sorry if i can’t see your comments right away i have all nsfw instances blocked, hope this is understandable lol
Hey, no worries. I understand your criticism, too. For what it’s worth, I wouldn’t ever disparage a whole sport/artform/pastime/etc in any serious context.
And I’m also not really saying that Iowa is pointless.
It’s exaggeration, for humor.
On a side note, I actually also have some HIGHLY complex feelings about figure skating, as it relates to race, gender roles, and especially its complicated (and often problematic) relationship with the gay community. My opinions are vastly too complex to really go over, in the short time I have to make this reply, but I’ll give a little bit of a summary. It seems obvious to me that figure skating is one of those spaces where it has been a combined shelter, prison, and minefield, for gay men. I’m not gay AND I have only ever seen figure skating on TV, but I have seen some problematic stuff.
On the one hand, figure skating has been stereotyped as a “gay sport,” and any man who takes part in it has to be prepared to be mocked and attacked. On the other hand, this didn’t mean that gay men who did go into figure skating had any more of an opportunity to be accepted as gay, just by being in that world. For the majority of the sport’s history, they had to hide in the closet, couldn’t talk about their sexuality on camera, etc, for fear of having their careers destroyed. Maybe the coaches, fellow athletes, etc, inside the actual sport were more accepting overall, but I’m certain there were always other individuals who were NOT safe people to reveal yourself to. Like theater and some of the other arts, I see it as a kind of sequined prison, where there were always threats hovering around everyone.
In the modern era, it has clearly gotten better…but celebration and pride can also lead to more stereotyping and palpable tension. Even from a casual, just-watches-during-the-Olympics level of viewership, it’s clear to me that men feel pressure to quickly confirm “yes, I am” or “no, I’m not,” as soon as they attain any prominence. Straight figure skaters tend to VERY QUICKLY mention girlfriends or wives, when they’re interviewed. Gay figure skaters tend to immediately mention boyfriends, or just talk about their sexuality. Like I said, I’m just basing this on what I’ve seen and inferred. But it’s clear to me that “the gay issue” gets in the way of the rest of the sport, and I’m sure that’s frustrating to people who are in it, as a sport/artform, and just want to focus on that.
And that’s without even getting into the the fact that figure skating is huge in RUSSIA, as well as other former Soviet nations, where attitudes (and laws) regarding gay rights are, ya know, barbaric and dangerous. On that side of the world, men in figure skating are expected to bring medals home to their countries by being beautiful on the ice, but without ever looking gay.
Wow, I did go ahead and type a whole wall of text about that, even though I said I was just going to summarize. Anyway, the point is that I’d never make a meme about any of what I just said. It’s too serious. It’s too potentially harmful.
On the other hand, if I make a joke about having to have a couple drinks to enjoy figure skating, I don’t think anyone in the sport is going to get really insulted. It’s just a matter of opinion. I’m a massive sports fan, but I just don’t happen to like that sport. I love ice hockey, and not just for its violent aspects, but for its display of grace and skill. But if someone said “meh, I have to get drunk or I can’t even watch that,” I’m fine with it. I mean, they do sell alcohol at every hockey venue I’ve ever heard of.
Anyway, hope you have a good day. I really and truly respect you for being so thoughtful about your whole response, and your willingness to reexamine your position. If Lemmy keeps attracting quality users like you, it won’t matter if it takes a long time to grow as big as Reddit.
Iowa’s more fun when you’re drunk too.
I actually did start to draw a line around the diagram, somehow, to highlight that connection. But I am far too lazy.
What do you have against figure skating? Even tho i dont watch it its a fine ass sport.
I respect it, but it’s just not my sport, for watching. Examining my opinions, I think a big part of it is the fact that it’s a judged sport that always generates so much scoring controversy and drama. That has a real ability to suck the fun out of a sport.
I think I’d feel differently, if I had been exposed to it more, or whatever. I know a fair amount about skateboarding, and was delighted to see it added to the Olympics, despite the fact that it’s ALSO a judged sport, with the potential for controversy. I just know a lot more of the terminology and the tricks of skateboarding, so it’s easier for me to consume it, on a viewer level.
Also, now that I think about it, I think I’ve always been a little put off by the “bitchy/catty” way that figure skaters are clearly encouraged to behave, toward one another. Lots of simmering drama always barely visible, just under the surface. Like, the athletes clearly actually hate each other.
For some real contrast, watch the skateboarders, when the Paris games come around. They embody the Olympic spirit in a literally move-you-to-tears kind of way. They’re competing with everything they’ve got, leaving it all on the field…and yet, every time they finish a run, all the competitors are high-fiving the person who’s just finished, hugging them, etc.
And they might actually be the pound-for-pound toughest athletes in the world. Watch the falls they take, just fully onto unforgiving concrete. Back in the Tokyo games, I was so blown away by the tiny little Japanese girls, falling and popping right back up, blood just flowing from deep scrapes and scratches, and they’re smiling the whole time. Meanwhile, look at what happens when soccer/football “athletes” have a guy walk next to them.
Suddenly, they’re flopping on the turf, holding their neck, pretending they’re dying. Fucking disgrace.
Anyway, tl;dr = I think there’s a good deal of poison and fucked-up-edness in figure skating culture, and that turns me off.
