If a mad-cow-like disease jumped the barrier to humans and began spreading through Americans, the main problem in eradicating it would be that basically no one would be able to tell the difference from the average ‘Enthusiastic’ Republican Voter and someone whose brain is melting due to an actual pathogen.
We’re actually not sure about that. Some prions do spread by eating the meat of infected animals, but I think we can be pretty sure that’s not what’s happening in a wild deer population. Prions can also be found in the environment, including deposited on grasses and plants, where that can last a very long time.
We do not know if this disease is or will become communicable to predator animals or what the potential is for environmental spread to livestock. We do know a bit more about the BSE than some others, but there’s a bunch we know exist that we know little to nothing about, and it’s guaranteed there’s more out there that we haven’t encountered yet.
Occasionally they do consume meat as far as I know (as several herbivores do), but if that were a serious candidate it would be among the principle lines of transmission being investigated.
Zoonotic diseases are investigated by cross-disciplinary teams with experience ranging from public health and disease experts to wildlife biologists and ecologists. I did some work on a similar topic with the National Parks Service so I know a bit about how these are approached. I have no involvement with this and I’ve never worked on prion contagion models - like I said, we just don’t know. But I do have experience in the area.
Prions have been found in soil, on grass and plants, and do not get quickly degraded by sun and rain. We do know that this disease is density dependent, so you’d need a model of deer going carnivore and cannibal in a density dependent natural model, which is not a phenomenon I’m familiar with.
So what I’m saying is that we just don’t know what the deer-deer vector is or if a predation vector exists as a secondary transmission or if one will appear.
Cool information thanks. Yeah wasn’t trying to say that that’s definitely how it’s spread but most people don’t know that they’re opportunistic carnivores!
Shoot an infected deer in the head or have it otherwise die violently on the ground. Prions can last in the soil for years and years. Misfolded proteins are basically invulnerable, even in shit like autoclaves. If cows eat grass that has prions on them, that shit could potentially jump. And a lot of people ranch their cattle on public lands where infected deer are, and where wolves are unavailable due to politicians, who would otherwise prevent infected deer from spreading.
The best thing that we can do is have wolves clamp down on the few infected deer immediately rather than generate large pools of infection that then start cross-contaminating domestic livestock. Prions and ebola are the two things that really keep me up at night.
Interesting, I didn’t know prions lasted so long on bare soil. I don’t imagine it’s a simple thing for a prion to jump from animal to animal though. Certainly not any less complex than jumping to humans? Right?
Yeah actually, my dad might have it as he ate plenty of beef in England at the time (not that that in any way makes me an authority on the subject) but there are plenty of prions out there and plenty of them don’t do what Creutzfeldt-Jakobs did. It’s not as if a misfolded protein exactly adapts or evolves to other biologies in order to procreate. It’s just a fucked up protein. Biology is complex and there are many many differences in brain structure from animal to animal. A single misfolded protein could affect one brain incredibly differently than it affects another or even not at all. Prions are scary but they aren’t trying to do anything because they aren’t alive and have no drive to reproduce, they also don’t mutate rapidly like viruses because they aren’t made of DNA.
However I will admit. Prions are fucking terrifying
I’m not well-versed enough on prions to make an incredibly informed opinion. Apex predators somehow have managed to survive it for eons, though. Prions are extremely odd, and I’m sure one day we will figure out how to reverse their effect. There are some theories that prions could have formed the basis for life if life was seeded by asteroids, as they are incredibly resilient to heat, radiation, chemicals, etc.
From the CDC’s website, it looks like CWD might not affect canids and might not affect humans, as we are just too different from the cloven-hoofed forest puppies. But much like consuming fish parasites that don’t affect humans, it seems they don’t recommend eating sick animals just on the off chance that you are patient zero for a new, fun, lethal protein :)
Deer arent eating venison regularly enough to explain the rate of its spread among deer.
Its moving through them someplace else. Which means if it jumps to us, its moving through us someplace else too. And we dont actually know for sure how its moving through them.
It probably depends on where you are, different parts of the country and different social circles have more or less hunters and different hunting cultures.
I know that around me in the circles I run in I pretty much everyone I know either hunts or has a friend (or multiple friends) who does and can/will hook them up with venison now and then.
If you have a couple hunters in a family, they fill all of their tags, are generous about sharing their venison with family and friends, if they’re unlucky enough that those deer have CWD, then that could potentially be dozens of people exposed.
I say this as someone who regularly eats venison and lives in a place where it’s relatively common as well but it still isn’t nearly as threatening as something like mad cow. Pretty much everyone eats beef.
It’s a lot easier to tell people don’t eat venison you hunted and contain it than it is halt the entire beef industry and tag everyone who may have eaten it yk?
I’m not saying it wouldn’t be bad, only that we’ve been through much worse as far as prions go and one like this would be relatively speaking, less of a threat
If a mad-cow-like disease jumped the barrier to humans and began spreading through Americans, the main problem in eradicating it would be that basically no one would be able to tell the difference from the average ‘Enthusiastic’ Republican Voter and someone whose brain is melting due to an actual pathogen.
Lucky for us prions do not spread except via ingestion…
Realises that we wanted to eat the rich
We’re actually not sure about that. Some prions do spread by eating the meat of infected animals, but I think we can be pretty sure that’s not what’s happening in a wild deer population. Prions can also be found in the environment, including deposited on grasses and plants, where that can last a very long time.
We do not know if this disease is or will become communicable to predator animals or what the potential is for environmental spread to livestock. We do know a bit more about the BSE than some others, but there’s a bunch we know exist that we know little to nothing about, and it’s guaranteed there’s more out there that we haven’t encountered yet.
Deer can and do eat meat when available
Occasionally they do consume meat as far as I know (as several herbivores do), but if that were a serious candidate it would be among the principle lines of transmission being investigated.
Zoonotic diseases are investigated by cross-disciplinary teams with experience ranging from public health and disease experts to wildlife biologists and ecologists. I did some work on a similar topic with the National Parks Service so I know a bit about how these are approached. I have no involvement with this and I’ve never worked on prion contagion models - like I said, we just don’t know. But I do have experience in the area.
Prions have been found in soil, on grass and plants, and do not get quickly degraded by sun and rain. We do know that this disease is density dependent, so you’d need a model of deer going carnivore and cannibal in a density dependent natural model, which is not a phenomenon I’m familiar with.
So what I’m saying is that we just don’t know what the deer-deer vector is or if a predation vector exists as a secondary transmission or if one will appear.
Cool information thanks. Yeah wasn’t trying to say that that’s definitely how it’s spread but most people don’t know that they’re opportunistic carnivores!
Just eat the meaty parts, avoid the brain and spinal cord and you’re all good.
The problem is that the brain is the part you want to splatter all over the Italian marble floors of their mansions.
New plan live butchering so that the brain and spine is still intact and no need to worry about Mad Bougie disease.
so Sub Zero’s fatality?
What a fuckin left turn from science to comedic genius Bravo!
I don’t think enough people are eating venison regularly for a this prion to be a serious threat even if it manages to transmit to humans
Have you seen zombie movies? It only takes ONE unassuming hunter… and then it immediately mutates into blah blah magic nonsense ensues…
and then it is airborne, and bloodborne
…
You are correct of course. =P
Reminds me of train to busan because of the opening lol
Shoot an infected deer in the head or have it otherwise die violently on the ground. Prions can last in the soil for years and years. Misfolded proteins are basically invulnerable, even in shit like autoclaves. If cows eat grass that has prions on them, that shit could potentially jump. And a lot of people ranch their cattle on public lands where infected deer are, and where wolves are unavailable due to politicians, who would otherwise prevent infected deer from spreading.
The best thing that we can do is have wolves clamp down on the few infected deer immediately rather than generate large pools of infection that then start cross-contaminating domestic livestock. Prions and ebola are the two things that really keep me up at night.
Interesting, I didn’t know prions lasted so long on bare soil. I don’t imagine it’s a simple thing for a prion to jump from animal to animal though. Certainly not any less complex than jumping to humans? Right?
Yeah, about that… ever heard of Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease?
Yeah actually, my dad might have it as he ate plenty of beef in England at the time (not that that in any way makes me an authority on the subject) but there are plenty of prions out there and plenty of them don’t do what Creutzfeldt-Jakobs did. It’s not as if a misfolded protein exactly adapts or evolves to other biologies in order to procreate. It’s just a fucked up protein. Biology is complex and there are many many differences in brain structure from animal to animal. A single misfolded protein could affect one brain incredibly differently than it affects another or even not at all. Prions are scary but they aren’t trying to do anything because they aren’t alive and have no drive to reproduce, they also don’t mutate rapidly like viruses because they aren’t made of DNA.
However I will admit. Prions are fucking terrifying
I’m not well-versed enough on prions to make an incredibly informed opinion. Apex predators somehow have managed to survive it for eons, though. Prions are extremely odd, and I’m sure one day we will figure out how to reverse their effect. There are some theories that prions could have formed the basis for life if life was seeded by asteroids, as they are incredibly resilient to heat, radiation, chemicals, etc.
From the CDC’s website, it looks like CWD might not affect canids and might not affect humans, as we are just too different from the cloven-hoofed forest puppies. But much like consuming fish parasites that don’t affect humans, it seems they don’t recommend eating sick animals just on the off chance that you are patient zero for a new, fun, lethal protein :)
Deer arent eating venison regularly enough to explain the rate of its spread among deer.
Its moving through them someplace else. Which means if it jumps to us, its moving through us someplace else too. And we dont actually know for sure how its moving through them.
It probably depends on where you are, different parts of the country and different social circles have more or less hunters and different hunting cultures.
I know that around me in the circles I run in I pretty much everyone I know either hunts or has a friend (or multiple friends) who does and can/will hook them up with venison now and then.
If you have a couple hunters in a family, they fill all of their tags, are generous about sharing their venison with family and friends, if they’re unlucky enough that those deer have CWD, then that could potentially be dozens of people exposed.
The mill I work at schedules their yearly maintenance around hunting season. First week both mills are down. Second week half and half.
Easy 80% of staff are gone hunting.
I say this as someone who regularly eats venison and lives in a place where it’s relatively common as well but it still isn’t nearly as threatening as something like mad cow. Pretty much everyone eats beef.
It’s a lot easier to tell people don’t eat venison you hunted and contain it than it is halt the entire beef industry and tag everyone who may have eaten it yk?
I’m not saying it wouldn’t be bad, only that we’ve been through much worse as far as prions go and one like this would be relatively speaking, less of a threat