Reminds me of the joy when watching interviews with people on the British/Irish border, when they learned they now have to buy their groceries 30 mins further than they were used to. They also said: “we didn’t vote for this”. What do people expect to happen when they vote for something?
It’s weird to see billions of dollars and thousands of media-hours invested into a massive industrial scale propaganda engine. And then, after all of that time and money and manpower, we get a “I can’t believe you fell for it”.
This is regardless of who wins. I remember conservatives smugly insisting their debt-sunk kids and grandkids were idiots for supporting Biden. I remember smug liberals pointing to the shoddy fly-by-night wall building operation on the border and insisting “You fucking idiot border conservatives got what you paid for.” I remember conservatives, in turn, laughing at all the liberals who thought Obama would bring about universal health care and climate change reforms and high speed rail.
Every fucking cycle we get this smug “Haha, you idiots fell for it.”
Remember when Biden was “only one term” and “the most progressive president in history?” His entire career was on the record for us to see what a servile and slimeball of an insider he was. At least with Trump you know you’re getting a bad deal, he wears his sleaze on his sleeve.
Liberals love the “Trump supporters are starting to come around and regret their ways” story. Every day for the next 1300+ days they will be posting this. In truth, the people who voted for Trump with enthusiasm (not just contrarianism, fatigue or ignorance) will find any way to spin his policies as a positive or a necessary evil. And frankly, anyone who voted enthusiastically for the Democratic party is capable of the same and demonstrated they too have no moral red lines.
Tbf, you were going to hear those stories either way, it’s in Russian/Chinese disinformation campaigns best interest to stoke as much division as possible
It works both ways
This is all exactly what I expected from a second Trump presidency and is exactly what I voted against.
They pre-announced all of this shit with Project 2025.
I haven’t heard any of them say this isn’t what I voted for. Sadly it’s exactly what most of them want. They don’t give a shit if democracy is lost.
So many faces these leopards are feasting on.
I’m not familiar with this meme. What leopard? And what does it mean when it eats a face?
“I didn’t think the leopards would eat my face!”, said a voter for the “leopards eating people’s faces party”
I’m starting to think maybe faces are delicious? Feels like the wrong takeaway
Yeah, schadenfreude is small comfort, but I suppose I’ll take what I can get to keep spirits up as they fire up the gas chambers.
Are the ‘stories’ in the room with us? He doesn’t post a link to any of these ‘stories’ because that’s what they are. Stories. What Trump is doing is amazing - Slashing all the waste out of the government - other countries need to follow suit!
Uh oh, the cousinfuckers found Lemmy.
That link underneath would lead you to it.
On the one hand, he makes a point, I don’t see nearly enough stories. But in the other hand, no, Trump may seem to be cleaning out the government, but he’s actually installing an oligarchy. The news only covers symptoms that are common between the two intents. I’m all for a good cleanse, but that’s not what is happening.
Yikes! The fascists have arrived. Let me quickly ban your ass. Byee.
lol. You’re hilarious. Do what you gotta do.
What do you call people who got conned by a conman. You call them suckers. That is what they are and that is what I’ll even call my boss straight to his face
Agreed, but this this the 3rd round of him doing the same bullshit. At this point they aren’t suckers, they’re cultists.
Maybe, MAYBE in his first term they could pull this “oh no we were fooled” crap but not on his second term.
We have a saying in Texas: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on…wait…how does it go again?
Ya can’t…get…fooled again?..
genxers spotted
Ummm…hope so…?
My MiL was one of those people who were initially fooled, but that lasted a week before she realized she fucked up.
If they suffer any consequences from their vote, they’ll likely just blame Democrats, or immigrants, or trans people, or [insert scapegoat of the week here].
as I have gotten older, the more and more I realize that the story of 1984 isn’t really a warning for the general masses but more of a warning to those people that are easily manipulated. The two main characters are so compliant in their suffering.
And if they get desperate enough due to the consequences of their actions, they will become violent towards their scapegoat. Let’s not forget that.
No he isn’t. They’re all fucking thrilled. Where are y’all getting this shit? Trump voters are tap dancing right now.
Like 60% of the male Latino vote went to trump, and I’ve seen Trump support shirts among those rounded up by ICE, so some of them are in the Find Out phase.
There’s also the idiot Arabic groups that helped get Trump in power by demonizing Harris then are all shocked Pikachu when Trump turned out to be exponentially worse.
There’s also the idiot Arabic groups that helped get Trump in power by demonizing Harris then are all shocked Pikachu when Trump turned out to be exponentially worse.
“Demonising Harris” here is a shitty euphemism for “Democrats refused to stop supporting genocide then told any and all voters, but especially Arab voters who might have particularly cared, to fuck off”, with the shocked pikachu in practice being Democrats who are surprised when telling voters to fuck off over concerns about genocide did not help them turn out the vote to beat Trump.
Then being racist about those same minorities by blaming the election loss on “Arabic groups” after monstering them as saboteurs and belittling their concerns repeatedly.
Almost like anyone with 2 brain cells could have told you that’s both bad policy and bad campaign strategy.
In an Oct. 16 memo, the leading super PAC supporting Ms. Harris raised alarms about being outspent on television. The group, Future Forward, said in the memo, which was first reported by The Washington Post, that it would be “difficult for anyone” but the Harris team to close the gap because of the higher ad rates that super PACs pay.
It was hardly Future Forward’s only frustration. Another memo, issued days later, pointed out “very high-performing ads that have yet to get a big spend.” One ad, Future Forward said, had ranked in the “100th percentile” — meaning it was the most effective — yet it had virtually never been aired.
Campaign officials, meanwhile, were frustrated that Future Forward sat on so much of its money until the final weeks, forcing the campaign to spend more on the airwaves earlier.
Another Harris challenge: After raising $1 billion in less than three months, a bevy of consultants, allies and others were often angling for a cut, including the chairman of the Democratic Party in Philadelphia. In September, the Harris operation contributed almost $25 million to other party committees, in part to quiet those demands.
Some media allies of Ms. Harris were also paid. Areva Martin, who hosts a talk show, was paid $200,000 as a media consultant, and she went on a battleground-state tour in October.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/17/us/politics/harris-campaign-finances.html
Typical left-wing economic agenda items like “living wage,” “affordable housing,” “paid family leave,” or “union jobs” dropped out of Harris’s vocabulary in the weeks after Labor Day. Tracking the use of more neutral terms relating to the economy — like “wages,” “jobs,” and “workers” — we see a trend line that slopes upward into early September before declining over the following weeks. By October, Harris was spending less of her time campaigning with Shawn Fain and Bernie Sanders than she was with Republican Liz Cheney and billionaire Mark Cuban, unlikely candidates to push any kind of progressive economic message, let alone a populist one. Cuban was gleeful enough to declare that the “progressive principles . . . of the Democratic Party . . . are gone. It’s Kamala Harris’s party now.”
This pivot wasn’t merely rhetorical: donors, consultants, and business-connected campaign staff pushed Harris to “clarify” or de-emphasize previous statements indicating support for a slate of popular policies on price controls; capital gains, corporate, and wealth taxes; and a host of other issues. Harris’s vague suggestions that she would engage in price controls to bring down inflation were watered down into a policy that already exists in most states that prevents businesses from profiteering on natural disasters. Her gestures toward taxing the wealthy became a capital gains tax proposal of 28 percent, far lower than the Biden administration’s proposed 40 percent; and she never took a position on Biden’s proposal to tax unrealized capital gains. And as time went on, the candidate spoke less and less frequently about her watered-down price-gouging proposal or her commitment to taxing the rich.
https://jacobin.com/2024/11/harris-campaign-economic-populism-democracy/
While in Michigan, Clinton criticized Palestinian and Arab-Americans who oppose the Biden-Harris Administration’s support for Israel’s war on Gaza, which has killed at least that 43,000 Palestinians, most of them women and children, and rendered much of Gaza uninhabitable.
In a speech yesterday, Clinton argued that Israel was justified in not keeping “score” of civilian casualty counts in Gaza due to Hamas’ October 7th attack. He also claimed civilians have been killed because they were used as human shields despite the fact the Israeli government has engaged in what even President Biden admitted was “indiscriminate” bombing, destroying mosques, churches, schools, hospitals, and refugee camps.
He also justified Biden administration’s support for the Israeli government’s genocide in Gaza by arguing that Israelis had lived near Gaza since “before [Islam] existed,” citing King David and referring to the Holy Land as “Judea and Samaria,” a term used by far-right Israelis who oppose a Palestinian state. Clinton stated that President Biden was fulfilling his “duty” to Israel by providing unconditional military support.
“Arabic groups” didn’t decide the Democratic parties campaign message. “Arabic groups” didn’t decide where Democrats spent their campaign money. “Arabic groups” didn’t ask for Bill Clinton to lecture them about Judea and Samaria and how it belongs to Israel, nor did “Arabic groups” emphasise running an entire slate of Republicans at the DNC, whilst refusing just one Palestinian American speaker that would have effectively endorsed Harris on behalf of the uncommitted movement on stage. “Arabic groups” didn’t tell Democrats to downplay their economic messaging for fear of upsetting lobbyists and rich donors feelings.
So ushering in fascism was the solution? How’s that going for them?
Waste of time talking this fool. Same type that calls the police on their suicidal friend and then is shocked when the police execute the friend. Those who allow themselves to be ruled by belief and feelings cannot be reasoned with, they can only be controlled.
What drugs are you on?
Why is it so hard for you to hold people with power accountable for their own actions, as compared with incessantly lashing out at random voters online? Why are you liberals so head in the sand delusional that you refuse to engage with any insight or critique of the Demcoratic party, how it operates, and the decisions that leadership are clearly responsible for keep making?
I didn’t decide what Kamalas campaign message was. I didn’t decide how she spent the money. I didn’t decide that ethnically cleansing Palestinians was too important a position to sacrifice after their own base and literally people within the state department told them repeatedly it was bad policy and bad electorally. No one single person or voter who you decide to fixate on and lash out at online because you got mad at seeing criticism of Democrats meaningfully changed the outcome of the election themselves. How Democrats chose to campaign did.
People aren’t controlled by political leaders. Choosing not to support the only legitimate option that wasn’t fascism is a stupid way to stick it to the leaders.
Yes, the democrats ran a bad campaign, but that’s a shit excuse to not fight against fascism.
People like you lack any concept of prioritization. If someone throws a molotov cocktail through your window, you don’t try to fix the window before putting out the fire. If you let the house burn down you can never fix the window.
People aren’t controlled by political leaders. Choosing not to support the only legitimate option that wasn’t fascism is a stupid way to stick it to the leaders.
Who said they were?
Yes, the democrats ran a bad campaign, but that’s a shit excuse to not fight against fascism.
And the democrats had the most means to do so, including as part of an election campaign they fucked.
People like you lack any concept of prioritization. If someone throws a molotov cocktail through your window, you don’t try to fix the window before putting out the fire. If you let the house burn down you can never fix the window.
People like you lack any concept of power and responsibility, or systems and systemic thinking. You’re right dude, it’s me, the only person in the world who could have stopped fascism in the US by voting for Democrats, despite the actual voting numbers severely outnumbering me, and despite the fact that the campaign wasn’t even (singularly) decided by people voting with regards to Palestine, and also despite me literally being in the UK and not having the legal or practical ability to vote in US elections, fucking numbnuts.
The only concept, and the only thing you seem to have the brain power for, is thinking exclusively in terms of individuals who you encounter online that you can shout at for criticising Democrats by suggesting it was their fault Democrats lost. Liberals right now are like someone who sees news of a horrific accident involving a lorry’s brakes malfunctioning, crashing into oncoming traffic, who then go about roaming the streets lashing out at random lorry drivers shouting “YOU DID THIS!!!” as the appropriate response. And if anyone says “people who are in charge of the vehicles should bear some responsibility for the functioning of the lorries” you lash out at the person who says that and claim it’s actually their fault now.
I don’t know, ask the Democratic party if ushering in fascism was the solution to not wanting to move away from endorsing genocide. Ask the Democratic party if ushering in fascism was the solution to not wanting to run a campaign that might have put them at odds with the lobbyists who pay them, including Kamalas brother-in-law, Ubers chief legal counsel who helped run the campaign. Ask the Democratic party if ushering in fascism was worth moving right on immigration and trans rights only to lose anyway.
There are some stories of trump voters that had their immigrant wifes deported and they are totally shocked, because “shes one of the good ones”
Sad thing is, they’d probably try to vote him in a third time anyway.
I saw a news story from conservative women who have government jobs that are now realizing DEI means women too, not just black . Not saying they’re rational but they’re out there
There’s also teachers who voted for Trump that are surprised he’s going to dismantle the department of education and freeze the federal funding they depend on.
To be fair, It’s not like it was a major talking point of the campaign or anything…… /s
Well thats quite a lesson to learn.
One of the ones in my office openly said there are three words he thinks need to come back “the r-word, the f-word, and you know the other one”. They are emboldened and giddy
The fact that they don’t feel (yet) bold enough to say the actual words when discussing this is telling. I’d love to see them pull that shit in front of the wrong person and get popped in the face.
Libs still coping hard from their losing genocidal candidate.
Genocidal…Phhhhffff.
We’ve upgraded to Super Mega Genocidal now!
Proof? I see this claimed constantly with absolutely zero evidence. Some people claim that Trump approved 2,000 lbs bombs that were stopped under Biden, but that isn’t true since Biden never truly stopped them. Biden claimed to have stopped sending 2,000 lbs bombs, but continued to do so anyways during his tenure. What has Trump done outside of enable the same genocide that was already taking place?
Trump is an idiot and a fascist. But I would like to see any evidence that he somehow sped up or made the genocide worse. Even the recent $7.4 billion that Trump approved doesnt compare. Its not even the biggest sale of weapons to Israel this year considering the sale approved under Biden before he left office. How much was the amount Biden sent? It was $8 billion.
Did you not see Trump deciding he was going to just take over the Gaza strip entirely
Only people as intelligent as Trump think that’s going to happen. Israel will never cede land, not even to the US. This is an excuse for Israel to continue leveling and exterminating the Palestinian people as they have been since Oct 7th, 2023.
Again, what has Trump actually done that has sped up or armed the genocide that Biden already hasn’t? The way I see it is that it’s the same level of support. The only difference being that Trump is mask off about the entire thing.
We are in the 2nd month of the year. Still 10mths of sales to go, so dont worry. We’ll break that $8B barrier!
Low effort ragebait.
There’s a big thread on /r/conservative right now circle jerking about how not concerned they all are and how it’s exactly what they voted for. Sure buddy, come back and say that when something shitty Trump does affects YOU which it certainly will.
Sounds like copium to me.
It’s reprogramming. Carefully orchestrated to normalize fascist behaviors.
I think this is giving them a bit too much credit, they’re not carefully orchestrating anything it’s just really easy to get a certain kind of person to accept fascist behavior.
Certain members push the propaganda and mods remove any dissenting posts. It’s not the common user that is doing it.
Yeah it’s definitely something people do when they really believe everything is okay
Imagine believing that Trump will come for the privileged white bros.
who do you think is going to be drafted into his expansionist bullshit?
Fascism consumes itself
all the people who refused to vote for kamala must be so pleased with how little palestinian genocide is about to happen. aren’t they? well? aren’t they?
no?
gee it sure sounds like their whole little plan backfired in the worst possible way come to think of it, ACTUALLY.
They’ll take no such responsibility. People are stupid and it’s time to stop pretending. It’s time to stop coddling stupid people, it only emboldens them.
You know what makes me so angry though? Looking at the way the Dems govern, even now in the face of this firehosed of shit, this was going to happen eventually. I’ve been thinking a lot about “who’s worse, the Nazis, or people who opened the door for them?”
It does seem that this would have happened eventually unless the rot was repaired, which didn’t seem likely. However being accellerationist about it seems so foolish. Why wish for bad outcomes to happen sooner? There is no guaranteed good that will come later on to make it somehow a better choice than living with the lesser evil now.
Stop blaming the voters for kamala’s bad decisions.
she threw her campaign when her campaign chose to abandon the very vocal block of anti-genocide voters who had enough votes to swing the election.
if your campaign can only succeed if several millions of people to change their minds suddenly, you ran a losing campaign from the beginning.
It’s the voters who voted for Trump. It’s that simple.
Although I didn’t have ”Trump ending the Israel Palestine conflict by making Palestine American” on my bingo card, it was always super obvious that Trump is way more pro Israel than Kamala. If you thought otherwise you didn’t pay attention at all.
Trump had the same number of votes this time as he did in 2020. He didn’t win, the Democrats lost because they had nothing to offer people other than “we aren’t Trump!”. It was a losing strategy in 2016 when the economy was sort of functioning and it only worked when Trump was in power and the morgues were overflowing with dead bodies. Now that the economy is shit for anyone naking less than $200,000 a year, it was a loser again. All the Democrats than ran on “centrist” platforms lost while those offering actual changes like M4A, housing reform, and ending money in politics safely won reflection.
Yeah, but blaming then is obviously pointless. It makes sense to blame the ones that could have prevented this: the Democratic Party and the ones who didn’t vote democrat.
I think you can just blame the democratic party. People shouldn’t be blamed for not voting for garbage genocidal candidates and their wacky condescending fanboys.
It doesn’t matter how good or bad her campaign was. All people in swing states who were able to vote but didn’t or voted third party have contributed to Trump’s victory.
If your election system requires you to vote tactically, you have no choice but to vote tactically.
It also requires you to campaign tactically. Kamala showed exactly what happens when you don’t.
If the election system requires tactical voting then it isn’t a democracy.
No you’re right. America only pretends to be a democracy, but it most definitely is not. The electoral college alone causes some people’s votes to be more important than others. Then there’s the first-past-the-post system where you only need 50% of the votes to get 100% of the electors, which screws up things even more. And finally, many people are unable to cast their vote in the first place. Nothing about that is democratic.
And despite all of that, you still focus the blame on the voters, instead of on the system which is working exactly as intended, including your part in it which you are actively playing while convinced you are really opposing it somehow (you’re not).
okay and what is your plan to change that system? because I don’t think Trump being president is going to help with that
And not participating in it is improving it somehow?
I still vote, but I gave up on the idea that we will be allowed to vote our way out of the descent into Fascism roughly 25 years ago.
You dont improve democracy, you have it or you dont.
You’re thinking of rhythm. You have it or you don’t. That’s a fallacy.
Democracy is constantly evolving and, hopefully, improving. No system or framework is perfect, and one that stays the same will eventually expose its flaws.
I’m still hopeful that we’ll end up better on the other side of this. Look at Germany now. Or at least a few years ago.
In a given moment, yes you either have rhythm or you dont. In this given moment, we have not a democracy but something else. I guess you could say I dont know what it is for sure, but I do know its not a democracy.
I suppose you could argue that people choosing to support an oligarchy is a form of democracy though, since it is majority opinion.
All people in swing states
At least you’re realistic in your vote shaming. Major progress.
Actually, for that matter, I DO actually want to incorporate your point.
The problem is the proverbial horse died of thirst.
You’re right in that it’s not correct for me to simply leave it at “you can lead the horse to water but you can’t make it drink”, because the truth is SHE DIDN’T LEAD THE FUCKING HORSE TO WATER AT ALL IN THE FIRST PLACE!
She silently held up a sign that said “maybe water”
Trump held up a sign that said “no water for anyone except you” (which was patently a LIE, there was never any water at all with him) while also making beckoning noises and holding a sugar cube in his other hand.
The fact that the horse literally couldn’t even read in the first place doesn’t change the fact that she didn’t do her fucking job and that he used empty populist rhetoric to lure the horse to a place where there definitely was NEVER going to be any water whatsoever.
We tried to nudge the horse to where there might have been water. But it’s just a dumb fucking animal and wanted sugar cubes. Now it’s dead (and it didn’t even get the sugar cube it was being bribed with) and
…
yeah. We have better shit to do than keep beating this dead horse. It’s too late for it to learn anything.
So, departing from that metaphor, in a very real sense I’ve been making preparations to help people survive and perhaps someday even evacuate. Complaining about the circumstances is not the ONLY thing I’m doing, not by a long shot. But I do complain. Because I’m stressed and need to release the metaphorical pressure.
If you know of any mutual aid groups starting up to construct an underground railroad now that the horse is dead and we have to rely on ourselves, I’d sure like to know.
It’s almost like it could have been easily predicted
Yep. As soon as I heard her stance on Israel, I got a sinking feeling. There was such hope and enthusiasm at first, but she just had to pander to AIPAC.
She also muzzled Walz and started being super corporatist.
The nuanced stance that Israel, an ally, was attacked and had a right to defend itself but that they shouldn’t cause a humanitarian crisis in Gaza?
That she was committed to a two state solution?
That she consistently called for ceasefires all of last year?
Y’all got played if you think Harris was pandering to AIPAC.
What good is calling for a ceasefire if there’s no leverage? Netanyahu ignored Biden’s calls for a ceasefire because he knew that Biden would just back down if he ignored it. Harris was the same. You can call for ceasefires until you’re blue in the face, but if Netanyahu can just say “Naw”, and nothing happens, then what good is it?
If only people had been talking about exactly what happened for months leading up to the election, maybe it would have gone differently…
To be honest, my prediction was “parking lot”, so the whole “riviera” concept was a surprising development.
The ethnic cleansing was obvious, tho.
My prediction was glass but I guess they’re accomplishing their goals just fine without nukes
Not by explaining it, because that was tried on and againd to no avail.
Dawg, the democratic party failed to energize it’s base by running a center right campaign with a platform of strong boarders, a strong military, and tax cuts. Them failing to get enough votes is there fault for trying to beat voters with the cudgel of trump while offering nothing to most working families. I voted for Kamala, and even I recognize this. I am really tired of seeing a comment like this every time there’s a post about trump. The election is over. Rhetoric like this only divides the left further.
Imagine thinking democracy is only your duty if you feel energized by the candidate.
Imagine being a Democracy and deliberately running an unpopular campaign so the financiers keep the money spigot on.
Completely irrelevant because
- This is what “forcing” the democrats to make a change looks like, all it will ever do is shift the overton window to the right and make things even worse.
- What really lost the democrats the election was years of gerrymandering, voter suppression and making it just difficult as fuck to vote in Dem areas.
Actually I’m starting to feel convinced the Democrats saw “The Producers” as inspiration.
“You can make more money with a
floploss than ahitwin!”As long as they keep losing elections, they can keep making money disappear (via laundering it). They sop up all the donations and laugh all the way to the bank, burning LITERAL BILLIONS OF DOLLARS on their cousin-in-law’s “strategy consulting firm” and tons of completely ineffectual “vote blue” spam, and pay themselves six-figure “speaking fees”.
The solution isn’t to just stop voting, though. Voting is merely the least inconvenient, easiest to access tool in the toolbox and the people who left it unused are morons no matter how much ELSE they are doing ABOVE AND BEYOND that. Voting is the bare minimum; you have to do that AND local party organizing, civics, community engagement, nominating candidates for local races.
But if you don’t vote TOO, it’s like you neglected to wipe your ass. The stink follows you and embarrasses everyone with you.
I don’t think I have any obligation/duty to democracy, given how its going.
“I didn’t bother trying to save it, so now it’s broken and failing, which justifies my past self not bothering to try and save it”
Rhetoric like this only divides the left further.
Liberals aren’t left, and the democratic party served its purpose to a T. These people who continue to defend it are too. Both of their purpose is to shift the overton window all the way in to fascism, which they are doing successfully, and have no reason to stop (until the fascist come for them, at which point they will wonder why no one is interested in or even around to help them).
Singling out and attempting to ostracize people who are objectively on your side because they’re not as “left” as you is objectively dividing the left. I agree with most of the rest of what you say but that’s just devouring the bait hook line and sinker.
Yeah so blaming other leftists who didn’t for liberals is really senseless and still divides the left
But those doing the blaming (E: liberals) aren’t on the left, and those who are on the left who wouldn’t vote for a liberal have no reason to be divided by a lib licking a boot. Libs might be dividing themselves, those who now see through the bullshit will move further to the left, and those who buy in to it will continue moving along with them to the right.
You’re arguing to argue, even if you don’t realize it. I didn’t really say anything about liberals specifically other than they failed with their campaign. You’re like, arguing against liberals with someone who said the liberals didn’t run a good campaign… Do you like arguing or are you just really worked about about something that’s like tangentially related to what I said and that I think you and me would even agree on, If that was what I was actually talking about. I never said liberals were the left you’re just… Being silly.
If I were running for office, it would be easy to say no to genocide. Why wouldn’t Harris do that?
Republicans would just spin the narrative by accusing her of being antisemetic (aka a Nazi).
So people should support genocide so that genocidal people don’t call them anti-semetic?
That’s a root of the problem. People were called anti-german for opposing the nazis.
I’m not voting for somebody who’s too scared or brainwashed to oppose genocide.
Yeah, the problem is stupid people. Stupid people who are incapable of understanding nuance. Like you, for example, that can’t understand the nuances of navigating an unfortunate reality. You, who can’t comprehend voting for the lesser of two evils, and instead will allow a psychopathic fascist to take over because you can’t navigate nuance.
You’re deflecting because you’re guilty that you voted for genocide. I’m proud of my vote. Are you?
Yes. I tried to stave off fascism.
The lady doth protest too much, methinks
their whole little plan backfired
Was there a plan in the first place? It would’ve looked like this:
- Don’t vote Kamala
- Trump wins election
- ???
- No profit at all, everything’s fucked
- Vote Cornel West because he’s an ok person who opposes genocide.
- It doesn’t matter at all because of where I live in this sham democracy.
- Continue to be berated by delusional genocidal libs for the rest of my life.
- Vote Kamala
- Trump does not win election
- There’s still hope for a better future
- Politics doesn’t end on Election Day. Continue to pressure Kamala over the genocide
exactly, and she’s gonna take human rights into consideration way more than Trump ever will
deleted by creator
Did you ever try asking someone to explain the reasoning, or did you you just assume whatever strawman you came up with was real?
ok you explain it then
Sure. If you make your vote conditional on supporting a certain policy, then you create an incentive for politicians to support that policy in the future. Politicians have no incentive to care about the concerns of people who support them unconditionally. That means it’s at least potentially the rational and strategic line to draw a red line somewhere, and if you agree with that, then it’s pretty obvious that genocide is crossing that line.
Pretty simple. As the saying goes, why buy the cow (give the voters what they want) when you can get the milk (votes) for free?
How did that work out for you?
I still don’t understand why just because Kamala didn’t explicitly oppose Israël, you choose to allow Trump to worsen the whole situation by forcefully deporting all Palestinians out of Gaza.
She didn’t merely, “Refuse to explicitly oppose Israel.” She and Biden were completely supportive of Israel, sending them more and more weapons (beyond what congress approved btw) no matter what they did and applying no pressure to them. They went after pro-Palestine protesters and refused to allow a Palestinian-American to speak at the convention. They made it extremely clear which side they were on, and thinking otherwise is just wishful thinking.
ok and what is better about trump?
I see an awful lot of people post-justifying doing nothing as some form of radical resistance.
Well, sure, maybe it is resistance, and maybe they have a clear conscience… But it didn’t do a fucking thing, did it?
I see it this way. They want to stop the atrocities in Gaza by any means possible. I can’t blame them for that, but I can blame them for how they went about doing it.
Let’s boil it down to playing a simple game. You can play by the rules, and play smart, and win. Or, if you don’t like the game, you can play a different game and win that one.
By voting for someone other than Kamala (or not voting) they are inherently playing the game, and playing to lose.
If you want to play a different game, then you need to do some Luigi shit instead of sitting on your thumbs bitching about things.
So in the end, they played the game, and they played to lose, and now we’re all fucked because of it, and I don’t respect that decision at all.
I’ve voted for the lesser of 2 evils my whole life and yet we ended up back to Nazi style fascism once again. Kamala would have just held status quo till the next election, no direction change is a door stop. Improving society for everyone is the only way, I don’t know if humans are capable of doing this anymore and I’m 100 percent sure that isn’t compatible with the “American Dream”.
I don’t follow… Kamala would have just held the status quo, so just to have a change in direction the country decided to go to hell?
What Is the Ratchet Effect?
This phenomenon gets its name from the mechanical device called a ratchet, which allows motion in one direction only. Just as a ratchet prevents backward movement, the ratchet effect ensures that government power advances inexorably, never retreating to previous levels.
It’s not like Democratic administrations gave us the voting rights act, gay marriage, interracial marriage, and abortion. Medicare & Medicaid. Ended Don’t-Ask-Don’t-Tell. The ACA may not be very close to universal healthcare, but it is a huge improvement on what we had, and it decreased the uninsured population by 15-20M.
There’s a lot more to want from a progressive party, but they have, slowly, made things better. Sometimes, the wing nuts claw those improvements back, and “Ratchet Effect,” “Both Sides,” etc are great propaganda for cowing opposition to the wing nuts.
Come on dude get that capitalist team politics boot out of your mouth. The Democrats helped the Republicans sell out this country, but enjoy the scraps they didn’t see. I don’t eat party peanuts, politicians are servants not gods or celebrities. I’m supposed to cheer because gay people are on TV today big fucking deal. Edit- also if you think Democrats or Republicans or bosses gave you anything willingly your doing a disservice to the people who protested and died fighting to TAKE those rights.
Show me a third option. If there’s beef and chicken on the menu, you can’t get a Mercedes.
All those people out in the street protesting for civil rights, fighting the Pinkertons, and refusing to work like inmates? they fucking voted. They got their people into office, and those people fixed the laws.
They didn’t get those things by voting, they got them by showing the powers that be that people united can do anything. The DNC exists to channel that energy into something harmless to the existsing power structures. The system is broken and everyone knows it but the most policy wonked liberals. Trump won because he at least understands that people are fed up with neoliberalism. At a certain point people would rather torch the prison than spend another day inside.
Your obviously not ready for the third option. It’s big and scary and probably will hurt a little. Kinda like getting a rotten tooth pulled. But enjoy your MacDonalds and reality TV, while the planet boils.
decreased the uninsured population by 15-20M.
That just means insurance companies are profiting. There’s no guarantee that people are actually getting health care.
So, I guess your argument is that ACA is bad because all it “really” did is enroll poor people in Medicaid? Or that the extent of their insurance coverage depended on the insurance they got?
You’re comparing your idealized plan with what got implemented, rather than what got implemented with what came before.
Well, it will soon be repealed so the debate will be moot anyway…
genocide is about to happen.
lmao libs waking up after over a year… acting like they suddenly give a shit about an ongoing genocide.
This is why y’all keep losing. Literally offering nothing but vile condescension.
Laughing at people caring about genocide is a strange position to take. And not an especially moral one.
It didn’t backfire at all. If we can demonstrate that the Democrats can’t win if they support genocide, then maybe they won’t support genocide next time. And if they cannot be persuaded to listen to reason, then they need to be replaced by another party and the sooner we start on that the better.
Y’all think this was unexpected because you never bothered to understand our positions or arguments. You just strawman us and then believe your own strawman. Trump being worse on Gaza was already acknowledged and considered, there is no surprise here and no regret, we made the correct choice and will do it again if we have to.
What next time?
This is what they voted for and it’s what everyone who didn’t vote, voted for.
Just because you’re single issue doesn’t mean the politicians are.
🎵If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice🎶
Like, people had been screaming at these single issue voter to not do it, yet they did it, everyone is fucked, and they pretend they didn’t do it.
I wouldn’t be this annoyed if it’s some small country but this is US, their policy affect the world. What worst is melon husk trying the same trick on other country as well.
this is US, their policy affect the world.
Yeah that’s a problem with empire. It shouldn’t be doing genocide on the other side of the planet. It’s what people are opposing. #casualimperialsm
everyone who didn’t vote
Imagine believing that everyone’s vote matters.
You again? Again, nuance…
